Pastrix Christine Caine from heretical Hillsong Church Australia is a teacher that the serious Christian should steer clear of. In spite of the fact that Caine teaches ubiblical word-faith/prosperity theology and engages in New Age practices, she has been a featured speaker for Louis Giglio’s Passion conferences and has preached with prominent Reformed pastor John Piper. (Here and Here) Piper, who holds to a complementarian view, has received a lot of heat for sharing teaching duties with a woman who claims false teacher Joyce Meyer as her mentor. Elizabeth Prata of The End Times lays out six reasons why Caine must be avoided like the plague.
1. Christine Caine engages in New Age practices condemned in the Bible, such as this “impartation” described in the link. (Acts 8:17-20, Matthew 6:9, Isaiah 57:8, Revelation 9:21). Simon the Magician tired to grab the power of the Spirit the wrong way and he was cursed for it.
In addition, Christine Caine endorses practice of pagan/witchcraft as seen here in Batterson’s Circle Making book blurb–
2. Christine Caine usurps male authority and rebels against the clear word of the Bible
She is an ordained pastor and functions in that capacity. Worse, she enjoys teaching young women to step into leadership roles that scripture forbids and is unashamed to say so. (1 Timothy 2:12; Revelation 2:20)
3. Christine Caine is part of the rise of the Feminine Church of Eden. (Revelation 2:20).
But what we see with most of these women that are rising in popularity is what appears to be a female dominant role in their personal marriages. Beth Moore regularly travels to speaking and teaching engagements without her husband, as well as these others. Christine Caine is an ordained pastor of her “church” in Australia, and also regularly speaks and travels without her husband. Husbands aren’t overseeing their wives’ writings and teachings, and any attention that they pay to their wives’ work is not through the lens of Scripture.
4. Christine Caine partners with heretics, promotes them, and endorses them. 1 Corinthians 15:33, 2 Corinthians 6:14; Romans 16:17-18,Ephesians 5:11). Christine Caine admits her spiritual roots were sprung from the bad fruit of heretics.
5. Christine Caine is a member-leader in a doctrinally heretical word-faith church. (1 John 1:6-7). Or, as SBTS President Dr Al Mohler put it, a prosperity movement for millennials that minimizes the Gospel content and diffuses a presentation of ‘spirituality’ instead.
6. Christine Caine twists scripture. (2 Peter 3:16).
Here she is twisting a scripture that warns against false teachers, that is actually rebuking those who warn against false teachers – something the false teachers often do. Here is a Pastrix Caine sermon review.
What shall we do if we see a sister following these false teachers? Warn them, lovingly. If needing to a second time, warn them lovingly again, seasoning your speech with salt. If they persist despite the warnings and either don’t have a husband to oversee them, have no proper oversight from a husband who has abdicated his duty, or who just are or are married to a discernment klutz, then various scriptures say either to admonish them strongly a third time and/or to break fellowship. Breaking fellowship might seem a hard thing to do, but remember, if a sister persists in her sin or won’t hear you after giving them the scriptures, that means they have already broken fellowship with Jesus. Continue reading
Related:
Complementarian John Piper shares teaching duties with a woman?
Chris Rosebrough Reviews Christine Caine at Passion 2015 Conference
Excerpt: The only thing we can suggest you are about to hear is something you would expect a clairvoyant to say. Christine Caine treats the bible in this sermon in a similar way how a clairvoyant will speak vague things into a persons life as though they are predicting a persons fate/destiny.
New-age practices
Joel Osteen & Oprah “partners” Joel promotes her LIFECLASS “IAM” Little Gods doctorine.
Oprah has mediums/psychic’s on her show
Deuteronomy 18: 10,11,12
is one of many scriptures that come to mind
I love that you are always willing to name names, as we are required to do in Romans 16:17. We must be willing to boldly take a stand for the truth of the gospel of Jesus Christ by pointing out the ravenous wolves that Paul warned us would be coming, and now…are here:
http://followingjesuschrist3.com/2014/09/18/false-prophets-and-teachers/
Wow all I have to say is thank God he will be judging me & not you people All I see you doing here is turning people away from God spewing such hate, who are you to judge?
These people you speak of are powerful speakers of Gods word.. It’s to bad you didn’t spend your time teaching the Love of God rather then sit here in judgment of people your time would be better spent. It’s so sad I just can’t un see all this bologna you all have a blessed life I’ll pray for you In Jesus name
Karen, I completely agree with you. People are too busy being judges more than preaching the Bible. Woman can be used and will be used by God wether some like it or not. God bless Christine Caine as well as Joyce Meyer and every Maria Magdalene out there! Blessings
Karen, you need to go back and read the meaning of scriptural judgement, we judge those that call themselves Christians, we don’t judge the outside world, read his the Bereans were described for being judges, they compared every teaching with scripture.
Many don’t like that a “woman” has been brought to task for doing something she shouldn’t be doing. God, not us, instituted the hierarchy in His church. Besides usurping the pastor role, her teachings are not biblical.
I’d like to know how you find Christine Cains teachings to not be Biblical?
Name one thing she teaches on that isn’t according to scripture and is not accurate.
I can assure you, you won’t.
And if you think God didn’t use women to lead men and women in scripture
Maybe you should try reading the word again. There are soooo many books that have women leaders in them.
People are afraid of what they do not understand.
The word says in the end times the ignorant will not be able to understand or see the miracles and the signs and wonders that the Lord is doing because they have been blinded to it. What are you making your God? Is it the written word of God, or are you caught up in tradition and religion. Focus on the Lord and get in the word. The Holy Spirit is in all of us and Big enough to show you truth.
Luke 19:39-40 3 9Some of the Pharisees in the crowd said to Jesus, “Teacher, rebuke your disciples!” 40″I tell you,” he replied, “if they keep quiet, the stones will cry out.”
So I am guessing you would rather the rocks preach instead of a woman of GOD?
Absolutely agree with her. Brother, you’re a legalistic joke and I assure you whatever church you’re a part of isn’t thriving and reaching this generation. You have something against the Passion Conference too..Wowww! I’m sure Craig Groeshel and Chris Hodges are somewhere on your “false teachers” list as well.
They are not rightly preaching the word, along with a long list of other prosperity teachers. They make themselves rich by promising you the same. Weak and shallow theology is taught, and many grab onto it because they do not read God’s word as intended. Match up all of these so-called pastor’s words with every word Jesus spoke in the gospels. If they are not preaching salvation as Jesus spoke it, run!!
Thank you Karen for speaking the TRUTH! These are the very people that turn people away from God with all their judging and misinterpretation of the bible. Reading the context as to the time that Timothy was written, women then were NOT allowed to be nor were they educated and that is WHY they were not supposed to teach God’s word. Joyce Meyer brought me closer to my walk with JESUS and my daughter is going into ministry to teach people about Jesus and HIS LOVE for his people! She was approached by a woman citing Timothy, and that she was in the wrong and my daughter said, ” Well I have a hard time believing that Jesus would disallow my entrance into heaven for dedicating my life to HIS word and for bring people to HIM.” Seriously wake up you people who instead of spewing hatred for people, love and let JESUS make the judgements.
I am sorry to say you seem like really unhappy, envious people who just seek to divide and bring fear, manipulate and imtimidate…
One of the scriptures cited here had absolutely no relation to anything i have ever heard Christine say, write or even imply… I am referring to your quote of Rev 2:10… How is Christine having a Jezebel manipulation attitude? Why do you cite verses out of context and with no relevance to cause fear and that let see through such envy and bitterness?
As someone said, i too am glad it is the Father who will be judging us all… He alone can see the intentions of our heart.
Wow, look at all the responses against this, we need to follow what the scriptures say not twist them around, Thank you for the warning, I was caught up in these heretical teachers and I am so happy God gave me discernment and showed me that these people are not teaching but misleading thousands straight to hell. My heart is broken and we need to pray fervently for them to open their eyes. You can’t add or take away from the gospel and that’s what they are doing.
Being that Christine Caine is a product of Hillsong
look up a must-watch video from Brian Moonan called – HELLSONG
Karen… you just don’t get it! These people are frauds, phonies.
Women are not meant to be in these positions. So many people
Are lost today. They are the ones who voted for Obama and Hillary.
I guarantee you did! I know because the simple fact that you believe
The hogwash that comes out of Caines mouth, tells me so.
Try the Catholic Church if you want truth!
Thank you, Amy, for cleaning up that mess. 🙂 And thank you for giving us a forum in which to teach the Scriptures and have “healthy debate.”
“They are the ones who voted for Obama and Hillary.” Versus voting for Trump, who is on his THIRD wife and trying to read quotes from “Two Corinthians”?
And I won’t get into the Catholic church and it’s covering up of abuse, or twisting of scripture to idolize the Pope and Mary.
I cannot believe I just read this comment on a Christian site. Thank you, Amy, for cleaning this up.
THIS is why the church has a tough time bringing in the lost. “Christians” publicly label entire groups of people, make assumptions about political affiliations, and vilify entire groups rather than seeking to lovingly understand and correct. How is a comment like Michael’s supposed to attract a lost soul? Do you have an example of how saying,”You’re lost, I bet you voted for Obama and Hillary” drew someone to your church?
Now, on to Christine Caine. I have heard her speak twice now (both at women’s conferences, and it’s my understanding that the Bible calls for women to teach other women), and have not heard her say anything unBiblical. As a matter of fact, Christine’s call for women to “lean in” to evangelism in this day and age and to NOT allow the politically chaotic environment to distract or discourage us from our calling to make disciples inspired me to examine the last time I led a lost soul to Christ.
It’s sad and disappointing that this site calls for us to “throw the baby out with the bathwater” and ignore Christine’s call for us to keep winning souls for Christ.
I am hard pressed to think of a single Christian speaker or author who I agree with 100% of the time (based on my understanding of scripture), but I am discerning enough to know what to discard and when to take note of a truth they are speaking that I need to apply to my life. Thanks to Christine, I plan on inviting several lost people to study the Bible with me this Easter season. I will NOT throw out that message.
(Marin) “but I am discerning enough to know what to discard and when to take note of a truth they are speaking that I need to apply to my life. Thanks to Christine, I plan on inviting several lost people to study the Bible with me this Easter season. I will NOT throw out that message.”
Marin, before you apply anything to your life from C. Caine perhaps you can use your discernment to see the wolf under the sheep costume.
Ever hear of Word of Faith?
“The doctrine Christine Caine subscribes to and teaches is Word of Faith (prosperity gospel) heresy. She is a product of, has held leadership positions at, and is closely affiliated with Hillsong², which is, undeniably, a Word of Faith “church.” Christine is a regular contributor to the Hillsong blog page, the Hillsong web site maintains a bio page on her, and she is a regularly featured speaker at Hillsong’s Colour Conference for women and other Hillsong events.
Part of Word of Faith heresy is the habitual mishandling and twisting of Scripture while teaching: taking verses out of context, attempting to make the Bible say things it does not say in order to fit the “theology” of the teacher, and reading oneself, one’s audience, or one’s own ideas into Scripture (eisegesis). You will find multiple examples of Christine Caine teaching this way in the “Additional Resources” section at the end of this article.
Christine Caine regularly associates and partners in ministry with false teachers. The Bible clearly forbids this in a number of passages. She has preached at the aforementioned Hillsong, T.D. Jakes conferences, Joel Osteen conferences, Bethel conferences, at Perry Noble’s church, Robert Morris’ church and conferences, Rick Warren’s church, and Steven Furtick’s church and conferences (all to co-ed audiences) just to name a few. Paula White considers Christine a friend, as does Sheryl Brady. Additionally, Christine has close relationships with Beth Moore and Priscilla Shirer, frequently sharing the stage or partnering with both.
But perhaps Christine Caine’s best known and most worrisome bond is with false (Word of Faith) teacher Joyce Meyer. Christine considers Joyce her “spiritual mother”:
https://michellelesleybooks.com/2016/03/04/chhave-no-regard-for-the-offerings-of-caine/
I am WAY too busy aligning my own life with the scriptures to spend too much time pointing fingers at others. I don’t share my faith enough (which is what Christine called out–and evangelism IS BIBLICAL so I’m thankful for it), and I have areas where I can demonstrate delayed or even a lack of obedience. Pardon me, but I need to focus WAY more on that before someone else.
Question for you: what are you doing to follow Matthew 18 and take your questions and concerns to Christine, Joyce, etc in person? You seem to have sincere concerns, so what does anonymously posting about them online do? Is it winning people to Christ? Is it getting people to repent? I do not know you to question your faith or beliefs, but based on what I have read, I do question your motive. You come across as just wanting to be right.
You don’t think they’ve been approached?? “Wanting” to be right? No, not really wanting to be “right” before God by contending for the faith biblically, of that I am guilty! It’s been shown over and over how these two (Caine, Meyer) twist scripture, and they’re supporters keep buying it.
Oh, so you have had a chance to talk with them one on one in the spirit of Matthew 18? Please tell how the conversation went. I’m genuinely interested (as I’m sure others are on this site) about how it went. Where did you meet? What scriptures did you use? How did they respond? I’m sure they used scriptures to defend themselves–which ones did they use?
When people are seeking to resolve conflict by following Matthew 18, I am interested in doing all I can to help seek Godly resolution.
I don’t need to personally seek them out, that’s been done over and over, Matthew 18 does not apply to confronting false teachers…… Is this verse what you think applies to dealing with false teachers?
Matthew 18:15-16
“15 Moreover if thy brother shall trespass against thee, go and tell him his fault between thee and him alone: if he shall hear thee, thou hast gained thy brother.
16 But if he will not hear thee, then take with thee one or two more, that in the mouth of two or three witnesses every word may be established.
17 And if he shall neglect to hear them, tell it unto the church: but if he neglect to hear the church, let him be unto thee as an heathen man and a publican.”
You keep appealing to Matthew 18.
Galatians 1:8-9. Satan seeks to corrupt Christ’s Church through false ministers who preach a false message. Paul is adamant that no change can be introduced into the apostolic gospel. If any human being, or even an angel from heaven, preaches another gospel (another of a different kind), Paul prays that he should be accursed. This emphatic language demonstrates the fervor of Paul’s attitude toward those who would modify any part of the gospel he preached.
II John 9-11. Anyone who goes beyond and will not continue abiding in the biblical doctrine of Christ has abandoned God. Believers, on the other hand, must continue abiding in the doctrine of Christ to have fellowship with the Father and the Son. Believers are to have nothing to do with anyone who claims authority as a teacher but who is not sound concerning the doctrine of Christ. Such a person is not to be given religious recognition of any kind, because to do so would mean that the believers would then share in his evil deeds. To pray for God’s blessing on such a false teacher is expressly forbidden, and to do so is to ask God to bless apostasy and heresy.
“Now I beseech you, brethren, mark them which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them. For they that are such serve not our Lord Jesus Christ, but their own belly; and by good words and fair speeches deceive the hearts of the simple”
(Romans 16:17-18). “O Timothy, keep that which is committed to thy trust, avoiding profane and vain babblings, and oppositions of science falsely so called: Which some professing have erred concerning the faith. Grace be with thee. Amen” (I Timothy 6:20-21). “I know thy works, and thy labour, and thy patience, and how thou canst not bear them which are evil: and thou hast tried them which say they are apostles, and are not, and hast found them liars . . . .But this thou hast, that thou hatest the deeds of the Nicolaitanes, which I also hate” (Revelation 2:2, 6). “But I have a few things against thee, because thou hast there them that hold the doctrine of Balaam, who taught Balac to cast a stumbling block before the children of Israel, to eat things sacrificed unto idols, and to commit fornication. So hast thou also them that hold the doctrine of the Nicolaitanes, which thing I hate. Repent; or else I will come unto thee quickly, and will fight against them with the sword of my mouth” (Revelation 2:14-16).
(Romans 16:17-18) “Now I beseech you, brethren, mark them which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them. For they that are such serve not our Lord Jesus Christ, but their own belly; and by good words and fair speeches deceive the hearts of the simple.”
The word “mark” is from (skopeo) which means “to look at, behold, watch, contemplate;” which is used metaphorically of “looking to.” It is used (Romans 16:17) of a warning against those who cause divisions, and in (Philippians 3:17) of observing those who walk uprightly that Christians might choose to walk after the example of the apostle and his fellow workers. In (Luke 11:35) (skopeo) is translated “take heed.”
The word “avoid” is from (ekklino) which means, “to turn away from, to turn aside, turning away from those who cause offences and occasions of stumbling, turning away from division makers and errorists.” It seems that we are enjoined to keep out of their way and not fall in with them. Shun them, having nothing to do with them. It appears to me that this would pretty much demand absolute avoidance. The reason is obvious. If a quarrelsome person is left to himself he will soon have nobody with which to quarrel.
Paul has nothing remotely nice to say about those to purport to speak for Christ.
Where does it say it’s ok to have others do the confronting for you? That’s not in scripture. YOU have an issue. Go take it to them personally. Don’t sit back and have others do the work for you.
Christ and Paul confronted people DIRECTLY. That is the CLEAR difference. They called people out TO THEIR FACES, whether in speech or by letter. Jesus called the Pharisees out to their faces. Paul wrote letters DIRECTLY to those who were out of line…he didn’t write to everyone else BUT them. Paul even confronted Peter to his face about his hypocrisy in front of the fellowship. The key word: DIRECTLY.
You are not confronting directly, and you know it. You’re sitting behind a keyboard, hiding behind the “well others did the confronting for me” argument, which just isn’t in scripture.
By the way Marin, you still haven’t answered an iota on Christine Caine’s association with Hillsong, T.D. Jakes conferences, Joel Osteen conferences, Bethel conferences, preaching at Perry Noble’s church, Robert Morris’ church and conferences, Rick Warren’s church, and Steven Furtick’s church and conferences.
I guess those are ok too.
I never said those ministries were okay. I have not said an iota about them, because I have not had any sort of personal interaction with them. I do not talk about ministries I have not had any sort of direct contact with. I only speak on my personal experiences, what I have read, what I have heard, what I have been taught, and what interactions I participated in. I do NOT comment on hearsay, other people’s experiences, other people’s commentary or “who heard about who said what to who when.”
I have seen and experienced the damage of hearsay, twisted words, misunderstood contexts, and the like, and I also am an avid believer that the Lord will hold me accountable for every word I say (or type), including how those words impact the reputation, feelings, faith, and guidance of others. I have seen words tear apart friendships, relationships, business partnerships, and churches, and so I want to use mine responsibly. So I am just not comfortable speaking about ministries or people I have not had interactions with.
I spend most of my time focusing on my OWN Bible study through prayer and time in the Word, as it is important for me to grasp a solid understanding of His word for myself (with the backing of the Holy Spirit) BEFORE I start delving into what other people have to say about the Bible, commentaries, and like. So that is why I’m not all up in what other people are saying about the Bible all the time. In the end, I need to know what I believe, and make sure my life aligns with it, before I start pointing fingers at others.
“I do not talk about ministries I have not had any sort of direct contact with. I only speak on my personal experiences, what I have read, what I have heard, what I have been taught, and what interactions I participated in. I do NOT comment on hearsay”
Hearsay? When countless of videos, articles, books, and their own testimonies have proven and shown them to be the wolves that they are? Then you can’t judge anything outside of your sphere, and you judge me because I do make a judgement, I don’t need to see C. Cain personally to hear one of her “sermons” or Joyce Meyer either, just pick up one of their books, watch one of their videos and their words either accuses or excuses their actions.
“Where does it say it’s ok to have others do the confronting for you? That’s not in scripture. YOU have an issue. Go take it to them personally. Don’t sit back and have others do the work for you.
Christ and Paul confronted people DIRECTLY. That is the CLEAR difference. They called people out TO THEIR FACES, whether in speech or by letter. Jesus called the Pharisees out to their faces. Paul wrote letters DIRECTLY to those who were out of line…he didn’t write to everyone else BUT them. Paul even confronted Peter to his face about his hypocrisy in front of the fellowship. The key word: DIRECTLY.
You are not confronting directly, and you know it. You’re sitting behind a keyboard, hiding behind the “well others did the confronting for me” argument, which just isn’t in scripture”
So you’re assuming I never emailed none of the people over the years? Do you want the standard canned answer I get? Or when I’ve pointed something on their website that was completely false, the usual response? It’s a Hollywood script!
Sorry Michael, the Catholic faith bows down to Mary, the mother, you’ll hardly ever talk about JESUS, mary didn’t hang on the cross 4 us, JESUS did, n when u speak of women shouldn’t lead in churches, I believe that’s in the old testament, not the Gospels, rock on Christine caine
Anna, thank you for speaking up. People who post here are haters and not lovers of Christ! They want to judge the world because it makes them feel better about their sad little lives. Let God judge, not these people who protest about these awesome people bringing tons of people to Christ. I grew up a Catholic and they spend so much time worshiping idols, I barely knew anything about Christ. Mary was who we worshiped and the saints more than anything. WAKE UP PEOPLE, THERE IS ONLY ONE GOD, Mary, the disciples, the saints are examples for us to live by, HOWEVER, WE ARE NOT TO WORSHIP FALSE IDOLS OR PLACE ANYONE ABOVE HIM. IF YOU ARE PRAYING TO SAINTS, MARY, WELL THESE ARE PEOPLE THAT DEDICATED THEIR LIVES TO CHRIST, AS SHOULD WE, BUT NOT WORSHIP THEM. I can understand why so many people hate Christians. too many are judgemental, when JESUS WAS ABOUT LOVE, FORGIVNESS, ACCEPTANCE. CAN YOU CAST THE FIRST STONE?
I have a question – Have you read Mark Batterson’s book The Circle Maker? If so, how in the world would you relate it to pagan / witchcraft practices? I’m truly confused and wondering.
To whoever wrote this, I pray that love invades your heart for a daughter of the King. I imagine you would get a lot more done for the kingdom of you stopped pointing the finger at people and just started loving till it hurts. Love is the most powerful thing on earth, I don’t know why you waste your time gossiping and making assumptions up about people… But it’s not my place to worry about that. Anyway be blessed ! I love you too!! Xoxox
The author’s name is listed at the top if you want to be able to properly address your concerns.
The people who write the articles on this site may share some truth, but they definitely twist scripture more than the “false prophets” they write about, as well as make loads of accusations with no documentation. After reading several, my discernment tells me this is nothing less than a cult. I pray those with ears to hear will find their way out.
Well said. I could not have said it better. God bless
Seriously? A cult? I would say the fawning over Christine Caine and other false teachers is more akin to being cult like.
” loads of accusations with no documentation.”
Please show me where one called out wolf has been accused without documentation. If you know scripture you could in an instance see where Christine Caine is wrong. The “don’t judge” paradigm doesn’t apply when someone calls themselves Christian, usurps God’s word, and wants to play pastor.
It amazes me all her supporters can only base their drive-by comments on “don’t judge,” presupposing what God does while ignoring His written word, or the Love syndrome, we all need love, we must love, God is only about love, Jesus is only about love, you’re not loving if you’re judging. A word of advice to those erroneously holding unto these beliefs, read your Bibles, put down your favorite idol for a second and read what Jesus said about:
False teachers, false brethren, faulty theology, and the biggest of them all the coming judgement on these purveyors of lies and on the whole world itself. Don’t mistake love of the world for the true love of God, His Son, and His scripture.
Are you intimidated by the words, testimony, presence of a powerful woman of God? This woman of God, like every other women of God has a powerful testimony, this woman of God, like every other women of God is a powerful witness of Christ Jesus that makes the name of Jesus great.
Every woman, girl on the planet is a daughter of the most high king, made in Gods image.
How many people has the author of this article rescued from slavery?
was the author of this article abused as a child and had Jesus heal their heart?
Is the author of this post aware of the prominence of women in Jesus’ ministry?
Has the author of this article suddenly become God and we are unaware of it?
Does the author of this article have the power of discerning a person’s heart?
Has the author of this article ever listened to Christine Caine?
I was at one of her events this weekend and I quote from her message “if you are called to be married, you are called to follow.”
Beth Moore teaches the same thing, but “oh my goodness! She travels without her husband!” Pluease! Traveling without your husband and encouraging women to submit to their husbands and follow their husbands leadership in the home! Oh what horror!
You mean man’s kingdom?
Amy, I am all for lovingly correcting others or discerning scriptures. But just as you assume others come on here “just to defend their favorite teachers”, I ask what do you come on here to do? Is tearing down others and their ministries winning souls to Christ? Is it helping these teachers repent? Why aren’t you obeying Matthew 18 and seeking ways to reach out to these people yourself? Talking about them and their ministries behind their backs is NOT of Christ.
As I’ve said before, if this is leading people to Christ or causing teachers to repent, then AMEN. Somehow I doubt there’s much of that going on. What I’m reading are a whole bunch of prideful “I’m SO right and they are SO wrong!” posts that aren’t helping anyone but perhaps the ego of the posters.
So, I guess Queen Esther is in hell? What about Ruth? Isn’t there a harlot in the lineage of Christ? God speaks to male and female…he does not discriminate. No matter what is said or written, it should all be tested and proven with the scriptures…not accepted blindly.
Sorry, Christine Caine nor Joyce Meters is Esther, do what Esther did nor follow what is commanded:
“13 And Mordecai told them to answer Esther: “Do not think in your heart that you will escape in the king’s palace any more than all the other Jews. 14 For if you remain completely silent at this time, relief and deliverance will arise for the Jews from another place, but you and your father’s house will perish. Yet who knows whether you have come to the kingdom for such a time as this?”
15 Then Esther told them to reply to Mordecai: 16 “Go, gather all the Jews who are present in Shushan, and fast for me; neither eat nor drink for three days, night or day. My maids and I will fast likewise. And so I will go to the king, which is against the law; and if I perish, I perish!”
Esther was at that place and at that time fulfilling God’s purpose to save the Jews, neither Caine nor Meyers are here to save God’s people.
Did you know that Lydia and Priscilla are both listed BEFORE their husbands in the book of Acts because the writing style of the day indicated listing the LEADER of the household FIRST?
Yes, Lydia was the LEADER of her house church and played a key role in getting her family baptized. Priscilla also led her household in the making of disciples. I’m pretty confident that both of these women were richly blessed.
I know I’m glad Manny and Amy don’t have a heaven or hell to put people in, because it sounds like they’d throw Lydia and Priscilla in. Wow. Talk about losing sight of what REALLY matters.
(Marin)”Did you know that Lydia and Priscilla are both listed BEFORE their husbands in the book of Acts because the writing style of the day indicated listing the LEADER of the household FIRST?”
“Priscilla and her husband were Jewish tentmakers, show me in scripture where she was referenced as a leader of her household? This silly arguement is what pro-female pastors (Christine Caine, Joyce Meyer, etc.) use to defend their position. As Priscilla is always paired with her husband, Aquila, it is difficult to separate her and place her on a pedestal of her own. Their two hearts beat as one. Harmoniously, they labored together in the service of the church. They walked as one for they had mutually agreed to put Christ first. In the six references where both are mentioned, the name of Priscilla comes first in three instances, and Aquila first in the other three. They are never mentioned apart. Is there any significance attached to the fact that Aquila is not named first every time, but equally shares mention with his wife? A number of conjectures have been put forth why Priscilla comes first at all in the references to them both. Some writers suggest that she was the more energetic of the two, and perhaps had the stronger character. Dinsdale Young thinks that Priscilla may have been a believer before her husband, and that she won him for the Lord by her “chaste conversation,” or that perhaps hers was a primacy of character and service, or a more conspicuous intellectual ability, or that she may have been of nobler birth and social quality than Aquila.
Personally, we see no reason at all for Priscilla’s name coming first in half of the Scripture references to her, even though she may recall the wonderful prominence of women in early Christianity, and in martyrdom and service for Christ.”
(MARIN) “Yes, Lydia was the LEADER of her house church and played a key role in getting her family baptized. Priscilla also led her household in the making of disciples.”
“Thyatira in the province of Lydia (located in what is now western Turkey) was famous for the red [variety of purple] dye”.[1] Lydia of Thyatira is most known as a “seller” or merchant of purple cloth, which is the likely reason for the Catholic Church naming her “patroness of dyers.” It is unclear as to if Lydia simply dealt in the trade of purple dye or whether her business included textiles as well, many historians and theologians to believe that she was a merchant of specifically purple cloth.”
“There is some speculation regarding Lydia’s social status. Theologians disagree as to whether Lydia was a free woman or servant. “There is no direct evidence that Lydia had once been a slave, but the fact that her name is her place of origin rather than a personal name suggests this as at least a possibility”. Ascough cites other examples of noble women named Lydia from the first or second centuries,[ so it is unlikely that she was actually a slave or servant. Because women did not possess the same equality rights as modern women, it appears unusual that Lydia would be capable of inviting a group of foreign men to her house without a man’s consent. “The fact that there is no mention of a man has been used to deduce that she was a widow. Lydia’s evident social power exemplified by her control of a household and ownership of a house (which she offered to St. Paul and his companions) indicates that she was most likely a free woman and possibly a widow.
(Marin) “I’m pretty confident that both of these women were richly blessed.”
Just like any Christian today, either male or female.
(Marin) “I know I’m glad Manny and Amy don’t have a heaven or hell to put people in, because it sounds like they’d throw Lydia and Priscilla in. Wow. Talk about losing sight of what REALLY matters.”
Presumptuous, ridiculous and like a Christine Caine “sermon” unbiblical. Sounds like your liberal-modern theology, empowered-woman paradigm is full of holes, I think its better to follow the bible, not Caine and her twisted notion of scripture.
Believe it or not, I used to believe very similar to you…that as a woman I had no power to influence other men, that I was to simply “shut up” and do as I am told by the men around me, etc. I used to come on sites like this and tear down women like Joyce Meyer and Christine Caine, much like you do.
It was my own walk with Christ, studying of the scripture, and life-changing experiences that helped me grow and see otherwise. I did grow to understand the writing style of scripture and understand why Lydia, Priscilla, and other women of the Bible were called out in specific order. I went from feeling as a “nobody” (given I am a single woman who lives in a different state from my father and brothers–we know what the “traditional” church thinks of women like me) to understanding that Christ saved me for a reason. And it sure wasn’t to sit around and be powerless (or maybe bake a cake or two for the church) until a man told me what to do.
I was honored when my former boss (who is male) told me that seeing the way I live my life inspired him to get back into his Bible and find a church for his family, as he had walked away from his faith after 12 frustrating years of Catholic school. I was also surprised, because I never shared my faith with him (after all, I’m a woman, and we know believers like you would’ve burned me at the stake for sharing my faith with a man). Outside of having a Bible on my desk, I hadn’t done much more than ask for certain evenings off to go to midweek church services. But it meant a lot to me that he noticed so much more than that. You may see that as “liberal-feminism” or call me a “heretic”, but I see that as the Christ in me touching the heart of someone who had lost his way. And I’d much rather that than to “shut up” or wait for a man to tell me what to do.
Second of all, I came to realize that coming on sites like this and calling people names, publicly questioning if they even know the Lord–WHEN I HAVE NEVER MET THEM–is NOT in the spirit of Matthew 18. I need to follow the scripture, which means to start off with lovingly going to them one-on-one, then taking a witness, and then taking it before the church. I have not met Ms Caine in person to have a conversation with her, so I will not breach scripture and start publicly questioning her faith or berating her ministry without giving her a chance to answer any questions and concerns I may have. I have heard Ms. Caine speak at two different women’s conferences (It is my understanding that the Bible is ok with women teaching women), and her call for us (as women) to not be distracted by today’s divisive, politically chaotic climate and to remain focused on winning souls for Christ spoke to my heart. While I have a lot of Biblical knowledge (I’ve been a Christian and serious student of the word for nearly 15 years), I was very convicted in how it had been a few years since I had won anyone to Christ. Oh, but in those same few years, I had attended plenty of Bible conferences and classes and had plenty to anonymously post about other people and their ministry on message boards! The Lord convicted me about that through Ms Caine’s message, and I will forever be grateful to Him for the message and to her for being the vessel. Like her or not, Christine’s message convicted me and got me back to the business of reaching out to the lost. That has more impact than sitting online calling people heretics. I have a friend I have started sharing my faith and studying the Bible with (GASP, and I’m a WOMAN!), and it is my prayer they will be baptized this Easter.
You seem to have a very very real gripe with Ms Caine that I encourage you to take to her in person. Rather than writing about her on message boards, I encourage you to follow Matthew 18 and attempt to reach her directly (her website, her social media accounts, her ministry, her appearances…including one in Chicago this week). While I understand having a passion for the scriptures (it is a passion of mine as well, as it hurts me to see people misled via ignorance of the scripture…and I have lost friends to cults this way), I do not believe it is beneficial to you, the Christian church, the gospel message, or the lost who need to be saved for you to go about attacking Christine’s ministry online. If you have won souls to Christ this way, or have gotten any of the people you attack to repent, then AMEN. (I mean, isn’t that the point?) Please show proof.
“Believe it or not, I used to believe very similar to you…that as a woman I had no power to influence other men, that I was to simply “shut up” and do as I am told by the men around me, etc. I used to come on sites like this and tear down women like Joyce Meyer and Christine Caine, much like you do”
You’re making this a personal issue, when it’s not. This is strictly how a person who is not qualified, is handling scripture. I don’t recall anyone telling you to “shut up and do as I’m told,” you my friend have a chip on your shoulder, and are having a hard time distinguishing between false gospel, women’s rights, and your perceive notion of what is biblical and what isn’t. You can’t see the difference between calling someone out for false teaching or calling someone out for being a woman “in charge.” You think this would say some kind of socialized when it isn’t.
When you are calling names, questioning the faith of, or making assumptions about a person, you ARE making it personal. I am willing to bet you do NOT personally know the people you talk about on this site. You don’t personally know me and have gone on and on about what YOU think I do or do not know.
I know there is a BIBLICAL way of calling someone out for false teaching, and anonymously posting on a site behind their backs is NOT IT. I have Matthew 18 to back me up. We can even look to the ways that Christ and the apostle Paul corrected and confronted false teachers, and your method STILL does not hold. You have yet to back up with scripture how what you are doing is the appropriate way of handling false teachers. So that’s why it comes across as if you just want to brag “I’m SO right, and they are SO wrong!” Show me how anonymously talking about people behind their backs is the Biblical way of correcting or confronting. I’ll wait.
What name have I called whom? Wolf? False teacher? they apply to Cain and Meyer.
“I know there is a BIBLICAL way of calling someone out for false teaching, and anonymously posting on a site behind their backs is NOT IT. I have Matthew 18 to back me up.”
Matthew 18:
18 At the same time came the disciples unto Jesus, saying, Who is the greatest in the kingdom of heaven?
2 And Jesus called a little child unto him, and set him in the midst of them,
3 And said, Verily I say unto you, Except ye be converted, and become as little children, ye shall not enter into the kingdom of heaven.
4 Whosoever therefore shall humble himself as this little child, the same is greatest in the kingdom of heaven.
5 And whoso shall receive one such little child in my name receiveth me.
6 But whoso shall offend one of these little ones which believe in me, it were better for him that a millstone were hanged about his neck, and that he were drowned in the depth of the sea.
7 Woe unto the world because of offences! for it must needs be that offences come; but woe to that man by whom the offence cometh!
8 Wherefore if thy hand or thy foot offend thee, cut them off, and cast them from thee: it is better for thee to enter into life halt or maimed, rather than having two hands or two feet to be cast into everlasting fire.
9 And if thine eye offend thee, pluck it out, and cast it from thee: it is better for thee to enter into life with one eye, rather than having two eyes to be cast into hell fire.
10 Take heed that ye despise not one of these little ones; for I say unto you, That in heaven their angels do always behold the face of my Father which is in heaven.
11 For the Son of man is come to save that which was lost.
12 How think ye? if a man have an hundred sheep, and one of them be gone astray, doth he not leave the ninety and nine, and goeth into the mountains, and seeketh that which is gone astray?
13 And if so be that he find it, verily I say unto you, he rejoiceth more of that sheep, than of the ninety and nine which went not astray.
14 Even so it is not the will of your Father which is in heaven, that one of these little ones should perish.
15 Moreover if thy brother shall trespass against thee, go and tell him his fault between thee and him alone: if he shall hear thee, thou hast gained thy brother.
16 But if he will not hear thee, then take with thee one or two more, that in the mouth of two or three witnesses every word may be established.
17 And if he shall neglect to hear them, tell it unto the church: but if he neglect to hear the church, let him be unto thee as an heathen man and a publican.
18 Verily I say unto you, Whatsoever ye shall bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever ye shall loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.
19 Again I say unto you, That if two of you shall agree on earth as touching any thing that they shall ask, it shall be done for them of my Father which is in heaven.
20 For where two or three are gathered together in my name, there am I in the midst of them.
21 Then came Peter to him, and said, Lord, how oft shall my brother sin against me, and I forgive him? till seven times?
22 Jesus saith unto him, I say not unto thee, Until seven times: but, Until seventy times seven.
23 Therefore is the kingdom of heaven likened unto a certain king, which would take account of his servants.
24 And when he had begun to reckon, one was brought unto him, which owed him ten thousand talents.
25 But forasmuch as he had not to pay, his lord commanded him to be sold, and his wife, and children, and all that he had, and payment to be made.
26 The servant therefore fell down, and worshipped him, saying, Lord, have patience with me, and I will pay thee all.
27 Then the lord of that servant was moved with compassion, and loosed him, and forgave him the debt.
28 But the same servant went out, and found one of his fellowservants, which owed him an hundred pence: and he laid hands on him, and took him by the throat, saying, Pay me that thou owest.
29 And his fellowservant fell down at his feet, and besought him, saying, Have patience with me, and I will pay thee all.
30 And he would not: but went and cast him into prison, till he should pay the debt.
31 So when his fellowservants saw what was done, they were very sorry, and came and told unto their lord all that was done.
32 Then his lord, after that he had called him, said unto him, O thou wicked servant, I forgave thee all that debt, because thou desiredst me:
33 Shouldest not thou also have had compassion on thy fellowservant, even as I had pity on thee?
34 And his lord was wroth, and delivered him to the tormentors, till he should pay all that was due unto him.
35 So likewise shall my heavenly Father do also unto you, if ye from your hearts forgive not every one his brother their trespasses
What part are you using to back up your claim to defend Cain and Meyer?
And to whom am I calling anything behind their back? I’ll call it straight to their face!
You call Paul as your back up? what did Paul call those that did trouble him in Galatians 5:12?
The strawman argument you’re trying to rope me into won’t work with me……
You said “I’ll call it straight to their face.” My point is you HAVEN’T. You can talk very big about what you WILL do, but what I’m talking about is what you HAVE and HAVE NOT done. You have NOT confronted them to their faces. You are talking about them behind their backs. Where is that Biblical? The FIRST thing you should do when you have an issue with someone is to confront THEM. Not tell EVERYBODY ELSE but them.
You are even going by a username that hides your real identity. But we are supposed to believe be brave enough to “call it to their faces”? I don’t believe it. I believe you have “keyboard courage”.
I didn’t make it personal, you did“
(Marin) “I know I’m glad Manny and Amy don’t have a heaven or hell to put people in, because it sounds like they’d throw Lydia and Priscilla in. Wow. Talk about losing sight of what REALLY matters.”
If you can’t see how presumptuous that is, well…… You’re assuming without knowing me, how do you know i would throw anyone in hell? Do you know me to say such a thing?
Yes, I do know you to say such a thing. When you question someone’s salvation, you are questioning their citizenship in heaven.
“You have yet to back up with scripture how what you are doing is the appropriate way of handling false teachers”
How to deal with false teachers
by Denny Burk on April 8, 2014 in Christianity, Theology/Bible
In my last post, we looked at six characteristics that help us to identify false teachers. In this post, we will consider what pastors and congregations are supposed to do in response to such persons who emerge in their midst.
1. Correct false teachers.
The apostle Paul tells us that we ought to correct false teachers in the hope that God might change their mind about their error.
24 And the Lord’s bond-servant must not be quarrelsome, but be kind to all, able to teach, patient when wronged, 25 with gentleness correcting those who are in opposition, if perhaps God may grant them repentance leading to the knowledge of the truth, 26 and they may come to their senses and escape from the snare of the devil, having been held captive by him to do his will (2 Timothy 2:24-26).
Not every purveyor of false teaching is a lackey of the Devil. We have examples in scripture where bona fide believers are the source of error in the church. Apollos was a man mighty in the scriptures who taught accurately about Jesus but who nevertheless was only familiar with John’s baptism. In Apollos’ case, his deficient teaching was an error of omission. He simply did not yet know the full apostolic message. Priscilla and Aquila came alongside Apollos and explained to him the way of God “more accurately” (Acts 18:26). Presumably, Apollos responded favorably to their correction such that Paul would later identify Apollos as a co-laborer in preaching the gospel (1 Cor. 3:5-9).
In Galatians 2, Paul says that he opposed Peter for not being “straightforward about the truth of the gospel” (Gal. 2:14). Peter’s bad behavior in this situation had a teaching function, and so Paul says that he had to oppose him “to his face” and “in the presence of all” (Gal. 2:11, 14). Again, Peter did not continue in the Judaizing error but was corrected.
The examples of Apollos and Peter show us that any one of us might be subject to imbibing and disseminating false teaching. As I have confessed elsewhere, I have been in this position before. The key issue is how we respond to correction. There are two kinds of false teachers: those who repent and those who do not. We need to be careful not to underestimate how important our response to correction is. Those who respond to biblical correction reveal that they have the Spirit and are under the command of Jesus. Those who refuse to respond to biblical correction are proving themselves to be devoid of the Spirit and taking orders from another master (Jude 1:19).
Recalcitrance in the face of correction is dangerous, and it is why the apostles would often apply some of the most bone-chilling descriptors to unrepentant false teachers. Unrepentant false teachers are,
“men of depraved mind, rejected as regards the faith” (2 Tim. 3:8)
“evil men and impostors… deceiving and being deceived” (2 Ti m. 3:13)
“perverted and sinful, being self-condemned” (Titus 3:11)
“bringing swift destruction upon themselves… their judgment from long ago is not idle, and their destruction is not asleep” (2 Pet. 2:1)
“springs without water, and mists driven by a storm, for whom the black darkness has been reserved” (2 Pet. 2:17)
Again, the stakes are high here. Response to correction reveals whether you are dealing with a brother or with a wolf. Restoration is only possible for those who repent. Those who persist in false teaching present grave spiritual danger and must be opposed. And that brings us to our second point.
2. Confront false teachers.
Pastors have a responsibility to oppose false teaching whenever it arises. As I mentioned yesterday, pastoral ministry is not merely a building up, but also a tearing down. It involves tearing down every speculation and lofty thing raised up against the knowledge of God (2 Corinthians 10:5). To fail to do this is ministerial malpractice and harmful to God’s people. The apostle Paul says that willingness to engage this kind of controversy is a qualification for office:
He must hold fast the faithful word which is in accordance with the teaching, that he may be able both to exhort in sound doctrine and to refute those who contradict (Titus 1:9).
Paul has a word to those who are pastors and who aspire to be a pastor. If you cannot or will not “refute those who contradict” then you should not be a pastor. God does not want shepherds to be pugnacious and walking around all the time with a theological chip on their shoulder. But if you are the kind of person who always shrinks back from conflict—either because you’re afraid or because you don’t want to risk offending people or risk your chance at gathering a megachurch—if you always shrink back from the conflict that sound doctrine brings, then you are not qualified to be a pastor. As long as false teaching exists in the world, you must be willing to meet this challenge if you are to be a pastor.
Confronting false teachers is not the responsibility of the pastor alone. The congregation has a role in this, which brings us to our third point.
3. Discipline false teachers.
In numerous instances, the Bible commends believers to ostracize those who will not repent of their false teaching. In other words, false teachers become subject to the church’s discipline. I write this as a Baptist, and so I would argue that the excommunication is a congregational responsibility and not something that pastors can impose alone (e.g., 1 Cor. 5; 2 Cor. 2:6). Nevertheless, even pastors in non-congregational churches must still rely upon the congregation’s cooperation for excommunication to work.
Where do we see excommunication coming into play for false teachers? Paul commands Titus and the believers in Crete to distance themselves from false teachers, “As for a person who stirs up division, after warning him once and then twice, have nothing more to do with him” (Titus 3:10). Paul ratchets up the rhetoric when facing down serious error coming from Hymenaeus and Alexander:
Some have rejected and suffered shipwreck in regard to their faith. Among these are Hymenaeus and Alexander, whom I have delivered over to Satan, so that they may be taught not to blaspheme (1 Tim. 1:19-20).
This latter text is significant because of the parallel to 1 Corinthians 5. In both texts, Paul hands someone over to Satan. That fact indicates that false teaching is just as much a disciplinable offense as sexual immorality. And so Paul excommunicates these two false teachers, Hymenaeus and Alexander.
If we would be faithful to Christ, we must be willing to impose the most extreme sanction that the church has to battle false teachers.
4. Refuse support for false teachers.
The first three points more or less presuppose the context of a local congregation. What are churches to do when false teachers from outside a congregation exert an influence within the congregation? The apostle John addresses such a scenario in 2 John and 3 John. He says that “many deceivers have gone out into the world” who “do not abide in the teaching of Christ” (2 John 7, 9). John says that the congregation has a responsibility to refuse all support for such teachers. Moreover, the congregation must not behave in any way that might indicate endorsement of their false teaching.
If anyone comes to you and does not bring this teaching, do not receive him into your house, and do not give him a greeting; for the one who gives him a greeting participates in his evil deeds (2 John 10-11).
The only teachers whom the church supports are those whose teaching is in accordance with the standard of divine truth (3 John 8). For all others, we must be clear about our rejection of their dangerous teaching. This not only applies to those whom we give our money. It also applies to those Christians that we would be willing to extend the hand of fellowship to outside of our church. We must be careful not to imply through our associations affirmation of false teachers.
In conclusion, what’s the point of confronting false teachers? I think we have to be careful here. One of the character requirements of the pastor is that he not be pugnacious—that he not be the kind of guy who walks around with a theological chip on his shoulder just waiting for someone to knock it off (1 Tim. 3:3). A pastor can’t be the kind of guy who can’t accept an apology or recognize repentance when he sees it. If he is that kind of guy, then there’s a real question about his fitness for ministry.
So here’s the question we have to ask and answer anytime we are refuting error. What are our motives in the confrontation? Are we just being pugnacious? Or is there a more biblically formed motive for the controversy? If all we’re trying to do is put red meat before the congregation or drive up blog stats, that’s not really a good motive. That’s the sign of a person who’s self-promoting through public pugnacity. Everyone can smell that rot from a mile away, and it’s not very becoming of a man of God (Rom. 12:18).
What should our motive be in bringing confrontation? The scripture tells us that we ought to have in mind the best interests of both the flock and the false teachers. Public confrontation ought to be animated by a desire to protect God’s people from being led astray by teaching that is spiritually and morally harmful to them (Acts 20:28). But it should also be motivated by a desire to see false teachers come to repentance and faith. Paul didn’t want Timothy merely to triumph over the false teachers. Paul wanted Timothy—if possible—to win them over to the truth (2 Tim. 2:24-25).
Let me ask you, are Cain and Meyer repentant?
You keep posting all these articles (written by men) about what people SHOULD do to confront false teachers, and talking about what you WILL do, but you are not answering my questions about what YOU ALREADY DO AND HAVE DONE and how WHAT YOU ALREADY DO AND HAVE DONE aligns with scripture. Perhaps this is where we are talking past each other.
I have already shared my comfort level (or lack thereof) with talking about people I don’t know without confronting them first, or speaking about ministries I have not had any interaction with. You seem to be very confident that your approach is Biblical, and in the end, that is what really matters. As I stated before, in the end, we will all be held accountable for our words, and if you feel great that the Lord will congratulate you on your posts, then AMEN! I am not at that point where I would feel confident before Him doing the same, so I only ask that you understand. I am perfectly okay with agreeing to disagree.
“Yes, I do know you to say such a thing. When you question someone’s salvation, you are questioning their citizenship in heaven”
These are those that prexumed, who named Christ, who did “miracles.” I do question false teachers, they’re deceived.
Matthew 7:21-22
21Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only he who does the will of My Father in heaven. 22Many will say to Me on that day, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in Your name, and in Your name drive out demons and perform many miracles?’ 23Then I will tell them plainly, ‘I never knew you; depart from Me, you workers of lawlessness.’
Man was made in Gods image. Woman came from man
I sadly find some of this ridiculous. While Caine and others have been proven by some, to someone’s level of satisfaction, to be wolves, ( I personally don’t care, and the reasons wil be explained below ) I find the idea you have put God in a box to be the hardest partt to swallow.
God uses all of us, however he sees fit. Living in the archaic mindeset that a woman’s place is in the home negates part of what God created and presumes mankind will not grow and adapt over time. Like the Old Testament is a handbook for raising small children, and the prophets are a way of example for teenagers, the New Testament serves as a college level class on living. Grad school is life itself in the church.
Likewise there is a broader definition of this concept. When mankind was childlike, before Christ’s presence in the world of God’s creation, we had the Old Testament and its teachings to guide us. As we came closer to the time of Christ, mankind in its rebellious teenage years, we had the lessons of the prophets. Then mankind graduated from a belief based on laws, as we all did growing up under the laws and rules of our parents, and came to live in a belief based on faith. We went to church and developed our faith based on our trust in God, which often meant trusting people who failed us. So we became absolutists until our faith grew enough to believe God’s plan was bigger than all of us.
Apparently you folks aren’t there yet.
Your absolutism leaves people out or puts them in little pigeonholes that fit with your rigid logic of scripture. God is bigger than that. To believe a woman’s place is smaller than a man’s is at best silly and at worst disingenuous to what God offers. Maybe you should stop thinking in the us v. them scenario. Think of it as Christ did when he fed the five thousand. The baskets kept filling up no matter how much food they distributed. Now lets flip that around and look at it from our perspective.
God gave you a lifeboat. Instead of distributing loaves and fish ( Humans do logistics well ) He wants you to save his people, because there is no land and people are drowning all around you while you sit in your lifeboat arguing over who is qualified to shout over the gunwale that help is here. I don’t care if its a man or a woman who pulls me out of the oceans of apathy and despair, saving my life and soul. Neither should you.
Lets get people into the boat and stop fighting amongst one another. God knows who the wolves are. And if a wolf pulls me from the ocean and I move on to someone better, because the wolf is more concerned with their next prey, then I am still saved. God looks out for us all, don’t you agree? And there is one thing you must remember about wolves which separates them from Christians. Wolves are loners. They only care for themselves. People seeking God care about others. It is this which gives them away. Eventually people who are following God will see that. Whether you point that out or not. It’s God’s job to judge them, and those who were false teachers will be judged all the more sternly. Judge for yourself who to follow. Put out your little warning marker if you need to when you find someone is acting falsely. It won’t be the one warning marker but the thousands of them which will label a false teacher like a bad review on Amazon.com.
So get people into the lifeboat. Its not about who is qualified, whether they are male or female, whether they have gone to college for decades or even if they aren’t human. Get them into the boat.
That is the only thing God really asks of us.
Loved the circle maker. Life and death is in the power of the tongue….nothing wrong with positive prayers and claiming blessings over our children. God made us equal. Sad that some Christians are so narrominded and judgemental.. .thats the reason people turn away from Jesus. If u cant speak life. Zip it!!
Lets focus on the Love of Jesus and love love love…be Jesus out there……Christine Cain, Joyce and all those you judge…..they love the Lord…perhaps u should look inward friend. God will be our judge!
I am sure Satan is loving the lack of unity and twisting of scripture this article represents. I am so glad that Christ is my example of the Word in flesh not articles like this and authors of them. I will live my life by His example, by His word and how the Holy Spirit reveals the word to me, not by man/woman alone and definitely not by this article or ‘ministries’ as such.
I don’t know why I go searching for these articles. For a good laugh I guess. Just like peter you don’t know what spirit you are speaking from.
Penso que isso seja inveja por Deus usar essas mulheres poderosamente!!!
Amo a Joyce, amo a Christine, a Beth ???
São bênçãos na minha vida e de milhares!!!
The most I have heard Christine Caine & Joyce Meyer teach on is forgiveness, healing process and how to move on in Jesus Christ. And this is very encouraging & very helpful to a whole lot of pole who have been hurt. And I have never heard them condemn anyone’s teaching like they are being condemned here. Instead of this kind of criticism, you should do as they do, pick a subject on your experiences, teach & encourage pole to walk in Jesus Christ. We all ask for the spirit of discernment & as we grow in spirit, will soon know who is who or the Holy Spirit reveals it to us without you being judgemental to a fellow human being. Stay blessed.
“Therefore, rid yourselves of all malice and all deceit, hypocrisy, envy, and slander of every kind.” 1 Peter 2:1
“Don’t grumble against one another, brothers and sisters, or you will be judged. The Judge is standing at the door!” James 5:9
“But if you harbor bitter envy and selfish ambition in your hearts, do not boast about it or deny the truth.” James 3:14
who are you to judge people, especially servants of God I believe that instead of writing false things, I pray God gives you the same discernment concerning your life. Don’t hate on God’ s people. Keep in scriptures, you might find better things to do than this
I read the title and I thought WHAT! then I realized you are in a bad twisted place.. and if I could meet you have coffee with you see your life then that would be confirmed.
Dear Amy, You have the right idea. But employ the wrong application. Keep seeking the Lord and His truth will be found by you. In the meantime, I pray for truth to pervade where lies now take hold. By the way, both Joyce Meyer & Christine Caine honor God, His call on their redeemed lives and they honor their husbands as well. God bless you.
I just wrapped up finals in Folk Religion & Animism at a fully accredited Christian university. At the beginning of the class, and many of the students were skeptical. However, by the end of the course all of our eyes were opened to identify animistic and occult practices. The reality is that while these religions are easily identifiable in places like the Congo, Haiti and Mongolia, they aren’t so easily identified here. Our western culture and the western church has become so syncretized with New Age animism that many Christians can’t tell the difference. The act of circle marking is occult in nature … period. Just because we think we are divorcing or reimagining the symbol from its original meaning does not make it holy. Would anyone who claims to be a Christ follower choose to wear a pentagram? No – we would feel convicted bc that symbol was created for the very purpose of rebelling against God. Treating God as a “Source” of power and energy for the purpose of our bidding is no different than conjuring spirits from the dead. God is relational but He is also Almighty God, Yahweh and there are no other gods before Him. As Christians, we need to compare the current, mainstream teachings to the Israelites of the minor prophet era – they were mixing in unholy sacrifice and worship. They were completely syncretic with the pagan worship of that day. What was Yahwehs word for them – repent, return or you will be judged. That word is the same for us today – we are responsible to test the spirits, research and hold everything up to Gods Word for comparison.
Very interesting Abby
It’s the old Creator/creature vs. continuity of being thing. You are absolutely right that the two have become blurred here in the west—and if so probably all over the world.
Thanks for sharing
Amen!! I couldn’t of said it better!!
First of all to those defending Christine Caine, the bible – Gods Word, makes it very clear -women are not to preach,so quit defending her,and attacking us warning others not to follow her for their own good, instead take it up with God and argue with Him if you dont want to listen to his commands and have issues with them, tell God he is wrong ,not us.Why dont you read His word instead of lazily listening to people who you obviously are unable to discern if they are leading you off of the path , its about Him not these false prophets. And the whole -you are tearing down His Kingdom bit just love till it hurts ,just love , love, love,anything and everything cuz its all about love is pure and utter b.s. ,you obviously need to read what He expects of and from you, and shut your mouth.thats right,shut your mouth if you are serious about God and His word,otherwise keep on truckin down the wrong path thats your decision He gives us free will.And the whole ‘tearing down His Kingdom, as if any of us are capable of actually doing that,are you playing with a full deck?Know it all, feel good self righteous, listening to people and putting your faith in them, and not Him and then running your mouths like you actually know what the h e double L your talking about, but go ahead if you must ,its your choice and if what you desire and want and think should be is the most important to YOU and not what He commands.
Also to you clueless ignorants and your weak pitiful statements and untruths saying “who are you to judge” and “stop pointing the finger ” type things, ….stating and pointing out facts is not judging, lol. nor is pointing out false teachings and trying to warn and help others to be aware and learn, again you need to shut up and start reading your Bible and learning His word and not idolizing people and your own self made ideals and desires, and stop spouting ridiculous dim witted statements that are absurd,shut up and read His Word
!
Incredible! I site that purposes to tear down people that are of the faith. Many of the people you are tearing down are God’s people and are in the faith, running the race. We cannot throw the baby out with the bath water, the fish out with the bones. Though they may not be spot on in everything, they are still teaching the gospel and people are coming to Christ. Please tell me that you have been right 100% of the time in your teachings and have never needed greater depth of insight. I follow many of these people and you know what, I leave what doesn’t line up with God to God to deal with. Ugliness! How is what you are doing here promoting the gospel of truth? I’d like to know. You will have to stand before God in all things that you have said including the ways you are talking about God’s people here. There is one church and we should be united. Christ said, “They will know you by your love for one another.”, not differences. One day all the walls that man created with denominations will fall and we will stand before our King and will most likely realize that none of us had it all right…as much as some of us might like to think. I pray against the pride that is here. I and pray that evil will not flourish. God can make anything come toppling down. I pray that you would humble yourself before the mighty hand of God.
“There is one church and we should be united”
Actually there are two churches, THE BRIDE and the HARLOT CHURCH. We are commanded to come out from her.
“they are still teaching the gospel and people are coming to Christ. ”
What Christ? Surely not the Christ of scripture, for we come to the Father only through Him, without the Son there’s no salvation, you can’t earn it, work for it, it is an undeserved gift, we can’t ever repay.
“I leave what doesn’t line up with God to God to deal with”
Then you’re not what you’re commanded to do, to discern truth from error, the WORD OF GOD divides to the marrow, Paul said the Terrans were a noble people, because they cared to compared what he taught against scripture. There’s no room for compromising.
” Many of the people you are tearing down are God’s people and are in the faith, running the race.”
How do you know that? See what Paul says of their I’ll:
2 Corinthians 11:13
13For such men are false apostles, deceitful workers, masquerading as apostles of Christ. 14And no wonder, for Satan himself masquerades as an angel of light. 15It is not surprising, then, if his servants masquerade as servants of righteousness. Their end will correspond to their actions.…
“How is what you are doing here promoting the gospel of truth? I’d like to know.”
By calling out heresy and false teaching, we are intended to judge those that call themselves Christians, we are not to judge with bad motives or pride, we are not to judge those outside the church.
“I pray against the pride that is here.”
Please show us where we have been prideful. Calling out error in the body is not pride.
” I pray that you would humble yourself before the mighty hand of God.”
The fear and our love of God compels us to defend His words, not man’s.
This explains what is happening today as The Lord’s return grows closer:
2 Timothy 4:2.
…2Preach the word; be prepared in season and out of season; reprove, rebuke, and encourage with every form of patient instruction. 3For the time will come when men will not tolerate sound doctrine, but with itching ears they will gather around themselves teachers to suit their own desires. 4So they will turn their ears away from the truth and turn aside to myths.”
Hi Amy, is it possible to add an edit feature to site? Like back in SUFTT? So we can correct any mistakes before permanent post? Thanks!
Thanks Amy! God bless!
Wow. This is so dumb. It is articles like this and people like you that make people afraid to go to church.
2 Timothy 4:2.
…2Preach the word; be prepared in season and out of season; reprove, rebuke, and encourage with every form of patient instruction. 3For the time will come when men will not tolerate sound doctrine, but with itching ears they will gather around themselves teachers to suit their own desires. 4So they will turn their ears away from the truth and turn aside to myths…..
“Wow. This is so dumb. It is articles like this and people like you that make people afraid to go to church.”
“People like you?” Please be specific. You mean judgemental? Using the bible as a standard? Calling out a false teacher? A Berean? A follower of Jesus?
“People afraid to go to church”………….. If you mean warning of wolves behind pulpits, yes….It’s called warning. You should be afraid to follow a wolf, it’s spiritually lethal, and if you read your bible it says to be aware of those spreading error and twisting scripture.
I hope your eyes will be opened to see the crass apostasy infecting “church.” GD is calling out His bride from dead Churchianity.
In point 6, it reads: “If they persist despite the warnings and either don’t have a husband to oversee them, have no proper oversight from a husband who has abdicated his duty, or who just are or are married to a discernment klutz, then various scriptures say either to admonish them strongly a third time and/or to break fellowship.”
Point six is given without a bible reference. I find this website quick to site scriptures to denounce the ‘heretic’ in question, but slow to provide biblical reference to support their own advice/logic…
I am curious to know the biblical basis for those who are unmarried to not be able to minister? I know I am using a generalized context, as some would argue that ministering is different then ‘preaching’ or ‘teaching’. Also, I realize this argument is contentious among divided denominations who believe preaching and teaching are men’s roles only in the church.
That said, taking the gender issue away (just for second), the confusion persists in this idea that those who are unmarried cannot minister. Paul himself speaks in favor of remaining single rather than marrying (1 Cor. 7:8 & 28), in order to devote whole-hearted service to God without distraction or obligation of the family. If marriage alone (or in the case of a woman) who wants to minister or have a place in some form of leadership or influence in the church is only legitimized in ministering through the oversight of her husband, then that would appear to be highly problematic for 2 reasons:
1) What then is the role of Jesus as our heavenly/spiritual husband (as emphasized in Mathew 25/ Isaiah 54:5)?
2) What is the role of a single women & widows in the church, if she is not preoccupied with the duties of wife and mother?
A response to this is appreciated. Thank you.
My friend you speak from emotion not wisdom, before you say one more thing, take out your bible, and compare what these women say to what scripture says, you’ll find their message is not anywhere in there. You are also bearing false witness ( you accuse of jealousy, envy and trouble making) and you’re judging out of pride and emotion, this is the way Christ forbids us to judge. You’re theology is very weak to non-existent if you believe these women have actually brought anything good to the masses. Pray for wisdom and for Jesus to control your anger. You’re not speaking as a Christian should.
Thanks, Amy! “Sanctify them through Thy Truth: Thy Word is Truth.” – John 17:17 Anything contrary to God’s Word produces tares.
Word? Faith? Teachers? You meaning taking the word for WHAT IT IS and SPEAKING AND FOLLOWING IT BY FAITH!!?? Good night read your Bible berean and how about not ” twisting” it when you do so. Word of Faith is what Gods Word is!!
Not even close to what scripture is.
” Evangelist E.W. Kenyon (1867–1948) is usually given credit as the originator of Word of Faith teaching.
Kenyon’s principal disciple was Kenneth Hagin Sr., the recognized “father” of the Word of Faith movement. Hagin (1917–2003) believed that it is God’s will that believers would always be in good health, financially successful, and happy.
Hagin’s principal disciple was Kenneth Copeland who, with his wife, Gloria, is the unofficial leader of the Word of Faith movement. While Copeland remains the leader of the Word of Faith movement, several newer mass media Word of Faith preachers have eclipsed him in popularity, viz., Joel Osteen, Benny Hinn, Joseph Prince and Joyce Meyer.”
All poster children of false teachers! These clowns do not preach the word of God.
Drive by poster, she would never back up her statement with scripture, as it would show the lack of discernment and ignorance of those that follow Copeland, Hagin, Osteen, Meyer and every other wolf that teaches that abomination.
No doubt! We must refute and point to the truth!
I think this is a site for pharisees. I’ll be sure to steer clear. It hurts to look at. I understand a loving nudge in the right direction from a truly loving soul who’s purpose in life is to point people towards heaven. However, I see the followers of this site not as such.
Why do you think you receive this feedback? What do you think you can do differently to appeal to the masses that you should be trying to save? What do you spend most of your time worrying about? What is your heart full of? I ask these questions in curiosity as I’m truly baffled by the material I find here – and all in the name of the same Christ that I follow.
“I think this is a site for pharisees.” Pray tell how? All that’s done here is to warn people!E of false teachers, false theology and false biblical practices, how is that in anyway being Pharisee?
“I understand a loving nudge in the right direction from a truly loving soul who’s purpose in life is to point people towards heaven.”
Christine Caine’s purpose in life is not to judge anyone toward heaven, on the contrary what she spouts is completely anti-biblical. If you know and read your bible that is quite obvious.
“What is your heart full of?”
Man’s heart is deceitful, and beyond cure…..Jeremiah 17:9. Don’t trust your heart, trust God.
“However, I see the followers of this site not as such.”
l suppose you believe “judging” others is wrong correct? So why do you judge then? Why don’t you pick up scripture and compare what she says to what the word of God says? You’ll find her corrupt theology lacking.
“What do you think you can do differently to appeal to the masses that you should be trying to save?”
Trying to save? Are you kidding? We can’t save anyone, we present the unadulterated Gospels, we present Jesus as the only way to The Father, the only way to salvation. The masses you speak about want nothing to do with that, they want to have their ears tickled by false teaching. An emotional empty garbage bag called Churchianity, where the Caines, Hybels, Moore’s if this world deposit their lies.
“What do you spend most of your time worrying about?”
Christians are commanded not to worry, as we know our God is bigger than any situation, we are to lay at His feet ALL of our cares, He provides. We strive to bring His word to people! Without blemish or lies, we strive with and warn others of the impending judgement coming upon this world.
“I ask these questions in curiosity as I’m truly baffled by the material I find here – and all in the name of the same Christ that I follow.”
Michelle, if the “Christ” you follow is the “Christ” that Christine Caine espouses, then it’s not the Christ of the Bible. I would beseech you to dump Caine and sit down with a bible and rethink what you have been taught. If you’re honest enough with yourself and do a bit of research in to Caine, Beth Moore and the myriads of so called teachers, you’ll find their doctrines of demons does not square with scripture!
Parting question: did you see The Shack? What’s your take on it?
God uses different people to reach the lost because every lost person is different. Had I listened to the Pastor who told me Joyce Meyer’s ministry went against the word of God I may still be 300+pounds tens of thousands of dollars in debt and struggling to find my worth and value as a woman of God. 20 + years of applying her teachings and continuing to learn from her as well as many others has taught me that our God is so much bigg e and more amazing than any human mind can comprehend. When we as Christians criticize each other we in public settings we become a stumbling block for the lost and a weapon of the enemy. I thank God for all of the women who followed the call of God and took up their crosses, facing so much opposition in the process. When learning we have a responsibility to also study and pray with diligence and seek God’s will not blindly follow the teachings of any man or woman.
“God uses different people to reach the lost because every lost person is different”
Seems to me that a dozen apostles brought the message to millions. It’s not quantity it’s quality, in this case the everlasting Gospels, unadulterated and preached exegetically.. something that neither Meyer or Caine does.
“Had I listened to the Pastor who told me Joyce Meyer’s ministry went against the word of God I may still be 300+pounds tens of thousands of dollars in debt and struggling to find my worth and value as a woman of God”
Your pastor is correct, your self worth, your weight and you fiscal condition has nothing to do with the saving Gospels, a good gym with good instructors, a good financial planner will do the same, the issue is whether Cain and Meyer handle scripture correctly, they don’t, they have also gone beyond the mandate of the qualifications to be a teacher. Meyer teaches word of Faith heresies that are available for anyone to read. You want to be a woman of God? Read what the real women of God did in scripture, neither Cain nor Meyer fit the model.
“20 + years of applying her teachings and continuing to learn from her as well as many others has taught me that our God is so much bigg e and more amazing than any human mind can comprehend. When we as Christians criticize each other we in public settings we become a stumbling block for the lost and a weapon of the enemy.”
Really, you need to figure that out from false teachers? God is beyond amazing, yet Meyer and Caine trample His commandments. When Christians call out false teachings, teachers and practices they’re doing what is commanded in scripture, or haven’t you read how you are to deal with those that say they’re teachers, but their not? The weapon of the enemy are the wolves standing behind pulpits teaching lies and heresies to the sheep, who would rather follow them than Jesus Christ.
“I thank God for all of the women who followed the call of God and took up their crosses, facing so much opposition in the process. When learning we have a responsibility to also study and pray with diligence and seek God’s will not blindly follow the teachings of any man or woman.”
Yes I agree with that, those women who followed the call of God, were and are obedient to God are a treasure in the church, good and Noble women that hear and follow their Master, not the worldly ones that ensnare the gullible, the undiscerning, the ones too lazy to read scripture, those are led astray by these false teachers. God’s will is very plainly stated in scripture.
I would ask you to reconsider listening to Meyer or Caine, there are many ladies ministries that are genuine and follow The Lord, if I were you I’d seek those out, and always text what’s taught against what the Bible really says, scripture twisting is a favorite pastime of wolves everywhere! God bless you, may He open your eyes to His truth, and may He be a lamp unto your feet!
Manny, I don’t want to jump too far into your conversation with someone else, but I’d like to lovingly bring something to your attention. When you make comments like, “Really, you need to figure that out from false teachers?”, what do you hope to gain from it? It comes across as VERY condescending, haughty, and insulting, as if you are laughing at someone who is “too stupid” to go elsewhere. I don’t know you personally, so I’d like to believe that it is not your intention to be condescending, so I’d like to make you aware that there could be another, more loving way of asking about why someone has chosen a particular resource for guidance….and to acknowledge that while the teaching may not be perfect, that they have obviously gained something positive from it. You seem to love uprooting absolutely EVERYTHING someone has learned…do you WANT to leave them with nothing? What will that do other than leave them in despair? I don’t see you recommending ANYONE else. I have been waiting for you to say, “Hey, I have concerns about what you’re learning about ___, may I suggest you go to ____?” In all of your posts to this other person AND to me, you have recommended NO ONE. But instead you find a way to question our intellect and ANYTHING good someone else is learning, leaving us with nothing. Heck, Christine taught me to get more diligent about making disciples and you found a way to completely trash that. I thought making disciples was a command of Christ…why is it bad I was called to do that? Because you don’t like Christine? Why can’t you say “hey, it’s great you are working on your evangelism…here are some better resources I recommend because of ___”?
I have felt my fervor for studying and deepening my walk with the Lord be VERY attacked by your making a similar comment. I respect your passion for “exposing” others–I have a similar passion around making sure people know the Bible for themselves so they can be appropriately discerning and have a solid foundation rooted in THEIR OWN knowledge (and not what someone else says or teaches), as I believe faith grows by hearing the word YOURSELF. I have also lost friends to cults due to their lack of knowledge of the scriptures for themselves, and it breaks my heart every day. But again, I think there is another way to inquire about someone’s search than to ask such condescending questions.
Ok, I’ll step out of the conversation again.
Good afternoon Marin,
In no way was I attacking anyone, if it came across like that, then I apologize, that was not the intent. But I will stand by comments regarding Caine, Meyer and all those that are still playing on people’s emotions while passing off a diluted version of scripture, once again if I’ve offended anyone it was not intentional. Bob bless!
Apology appreciated. Again, I didn’t think that was your intention and so I thought I’d just bring it to your attention.
I encourage you to respect that just as you “throw away” everything that comes out of the mouths of Caine, Meyer, et al, please respect those who are able to “throw away” what they disagree with while also “taking in” what they find to be Biblical.
You can disagree with me, but I encourage you to remain teachable to whoever God puts in your path…it can be amazing what He can teach you through the most unlikely of sources. I’ve had non-Christians call out amazing observations about my character (both good and bad) and speak unbelievable truth into my life….I even grew to fall in love with the scripture through being challenged about the path to salvation by a cult member! So you never know….
Totally agree with her being a false teacher and not a pastor as its not Biblical. Confused as why you added, traveling without her husband. I understand you want her husband overseeing what she says…but traveling without your husband for work is not, in it self, a sin
And is that true? While I am not an avid follower of Caine, Meyer or Beth Moore, the times I have seen them, their husbands were in the audience (and their travel schedules referenced).
Pharisees warned of Jesus too. Study of the two commandments Jesus left us would be better use of your time. How can anyone hear the voice of the Holy Spirit with all these self proclaimed wise know it alls. If you have been healed of an abusive past while listening to Christine, thank God and move out of this page…which is what I am doing now.
It isn’t wrong for women who are in Christ to correct error – Act 18:26 “And he began to speak boldly in the synagogue: whom when Aquila and Priscilla had heard, they took him unto them, and expounded unto him the way of God more perfectly”. Take note of how Priscilla, along with her husband, corrected the error of Apollos.
It is strictly forbidden by God for a woman to preach/teach when there are believers gathered to worship, as 1 Timothy 2 clearly states.
Now, aren’t you judging by referring to others here as ‘Pharisees’? Who were you directing this to?
You are correct.
BTW….I love the fact that not only yourself, but many women on here reply by teaching which word she supposedly is teaching wrong. In doing so, you are also females teaching the word. Just saying.
I am not sure how you expect abused…and sexually abused women to be taught who they are in Christ by men, either.
I am sad to think that you guys would call yourselves Christians when you don’t act like it. You sit there and judge others who are you to judge. I guess you guys would be the first to throw the first stone. You guys sound more like a Witch Hunt than Christians bad example for Christianity. We are supposed to be out there winning people to Christ the end time is near. Our job is not to judge others. I listen to Christine Caines messages and I’ve never heard anything bad. It is not for me to judge you but maybe you should learn to shut your mouth. It is for God to judge and not for people. Remember Deborah was in the Bible and she was a prophetess is nothing wrong with women being in the ministry. I pray that you haven’t turned anyone away from God by listening to your bunch of garbage.
You know for someone who looks down on “judging,” you sure do a lot of it.
Tami – I agree… so saddening and yes, if i did not know the father these people would def turn me away from His love. Nothing loving here as far as i can see…
False teachers are those who preach against God’s Word. Names that comes to mind are cult leaders like Jim Jones, Charles Manson, and David Koresh, that ended up promoting themselves as God. There are many other denominations that have been around for years that teach false doctrines Scientology and Jehovah’s Witnesses come to mind. I disagree that Christine Caine, Joyce Meyer, Beth Moore and Priscilla Shirer are false teachers. They preach the word. They teach women and if men listen to them so be it. If God called them to preach then who are you to deny what God has called them. I know several women pastors that teach to men. Why, because God has called them to that profession. There are several women in the Bible that also were in the ministry to proclaim the gospel. We are all called to preach the gospel to others not only men!
Hmmm, sadly, after reading all these comments, which were initiated by the original article It has affirmed even more my belief that we all just don’t get it! We sit in our I see names of preaches being thrown around without regard, I see many arguments going back and forth trying to outdo one another with self-knowledge and a a tonne of Bible bashing.
I watched T.D. Jakes accept an invite to speak in a room with some reformed guy’s in 2012 to discuss his belief in the oneness dcotrine of the church to which he categorically spoke of his background in that momvement and how since then he has moved away from that doctrine toa trinitarian doctrine, he was asked every question of the beliefs of the Chrsitain faith and affirmed them all. It was a fantastic interview from a man who showed he was searching for truth and was willing to change.
His important and humbling messgae to us all was that we need to be willing to sit down with those who (we claim to be false) or maybe are not false but have poor doctrinal beliefs and work with one another. I can claim John McArthur as total heretic for some of the teaching’s he has preached, I can claim, Rick Warren is or any preacher. People are NOT heretics and false teacher because they preach something we do not gree with. We must allow or error otherwise we cannot trully attend any church because as soon as we walk in there is sin and error. No preacher gets it 100% correct. But it is their heart God is looking at, are they teahcable, do they accept correction well.
As a minister myself, I cannot tell you how often the Lord has rebuked me after something I preached, we dont see the side of the preachers personal walk with the Lord who believe me will deal with whatever we speak.
I finish with this.
Grace!
Maybe it’s time to watch this short clip. If you hate the sheep you will not warn them against the ravenous wolves we have been told would come. You are more careful not to offend humans than you are to offend God.
https://youtu.be/MdgiWvVvv5Q
I Love Christine Caines sermons … Not you or anyone else will stop me from listening to her .. HAVE a nice blessed day …
Maybe this doesn’t have anything to do with the subject I know is that Christine came convinced my girlfriend that her parents were going to die if she didn’t give her money and she ended up giving her entire savings on top of that Christine Caine told my girlfriend that her parents also had to give money but her parents did not want to give money so she tried to steal it from them and then got caught after that she bore owed money to give to christine’s king and I’m talking thousands of dollars this is what Christine Caine did to me And my girlfriend I didn’t know anything about it until it was all done Meanwhile I’m watching my girlfriend go through hell because she wants all this money to give to Christine Caine anyway she possibly can get it she has turned into a nut case and there doesn’t seem to be anything I can do about it so here I am Making my comment
If the message they are preaching are not the message of the True Gospel of Jesus Christ, they are not preaching truth and therefore are not bound by the rules for taking aside someone in the church. They are not the true church. We are to rebuke openly false teaching. We name names not because we have issues personally with the person, but the teaching which we are absolutely supposed to judge against scripture. We rebuke it because we don’t want people to be misled. Kudos to the author for speaking out. Jesus said “Narrow is the road” and “only a FEW find it”. The mass followings, the “hundreds for Christ” are just numbers. What do we know really? We can’t judge the hearts of the alleged converted, but we absolutely can judge the teaching. If it’s a false doctrine, it’s a false doctrine, no matter you feelings about it. God’s Word and his truth are more important than how you feel about it.
I genuinely thought this was a joke HAHAHA. I have no idea who it is that wrote this but you are a mess. LOL! You obviously have no clue what it is you are talking about and have never heard any of these people speak. This is such a mess. I really hope no one reads this and takes it seriously. I also hope this person finds truth and happiness in God and in his word. You are way off base here and this is a pretty ridiculous article. I am still laughing.
Having worked with A21, which is a top flight global organization fighting human trafficking, and seeing that the common thread in this and other articles criticizing Caine was the fact that she dares to preach to men–while ignoring the prophetesses and judges in the Bible that God chose–I was inclined to support her. When a person, especially one claiming to be a Christian, however, takes the hard-fought life story and lessons of another and puts them in two of her books as her own without any source attribution, there is something very, very wrong in that person’s life. In sum, this is a useful article that needs some updating with recent developments in Caine’s life.