Prophecy watchers morphing into a mixed Apocalyptic bag

 

“Apocalyptic scenarios sell. No wonder there is a temptation to enhance Scripture with extrabiblical and alternative future scenarios. Postmodern teachers are rapidly leaving Sola Scripture to add in mystical components, and the prophecy circuit teachers are no exception.”
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The intro paragraph above was written by researcher Sarah Leslie in 2013. The image is from a promotional conference happening this summer. What do you see?

A friend of mine asked me to check out a prophecy website tonight, Prophecy Watchers. Having not heard of the site, I decided to give it a look.  It took me one whiff – two seconds – to become extremely concerned.

Was it the combination of known false teachers with their extra biblical sources and books for sale?  I’m not going to spend time warning you about the New Apostolic Reformation implications of individual members of this group, other than to point you to our Dominionism/NAR white paper, which is a must-read if you follow any of these gentlemen or their teachings.

No, I am simply going to list the names of their upcoming Prophecy Conference presenters and let you draw your own conclusions. Here are the people who have linked hands together in spiritual unity:

Gary Stearman, Tom Horn, Chuck Missler, L.A. Marzulli, Randall Price, Bill Koenig, Avi Lipkin, Aaron Lipkin, Cris Putnam, Tim Mahoney, Joseph Farah, Paul McGuire, Derek Gilbert, Bill Salus, Stan Deyo, Bob Maginnis, Carl Teichrib, Joel Richardson, Michael Lake, Josh Peck, Doc Marquis, Douglas Stauffer, Tom Hughes, Ken Johnson, Jeff Kinley and Brent Miller.

Gary Stearman and Bill Salus started Prophecy Watchers a few years ago, roping in folks like Jonathan Cahn, Chuck Missler, Tom Horn, WND’s Joe Farah,  and Avi Lipkin, a non-Messianic Jew who rejects Christ as Messiah. Their books are all for sale on the Prophecy Watchers site, along with books about aliens, UFOs and Nephilim.

Maybe you have some “good ones” you follow on this list. If that’s the case, you may want to get on the horn and ask some questions about whom they are joining hands with. (Not that Matthew 18 applies to public teaching or partnerships – it would be a nice thing to do for them and for their sheep.)

Bill Salus has been teaching the sheep from Scripture his dreams and visions he calls the Now Prophecies:

Do you believe the Lord still works through dreams and visions?  Bill Salus does. A few months ago Bill awoke in the middle of the night after hearing these words in a dream—The Now Prophecies. Bill was convinced it was a message straight from God. As the thought of going back to sleep crossed his mind, his cell phone rang. It was a call from somewhere in Africa and they didn’t speak a word of English! Wide awake now, Bill took it as a sign and he began writing like he never had before—in complete seclusion for 4 straight months! As things come to a head in the Middle East, the nations of the world seem poised once again for battle. Israel, Russia, Syria, Iran, Egypt, Saudi Arabia, Jordan and the USA . . . are we about to see World War 3? Is this the season? Are Psalm 83, Ezekiel 38, Isaiah 17 and Jeremiah 49 about to be fulfilled in rapid fire succession? These are most certainly the NOW Prophecies.

This isn’t your grandpa’s pre-trib, premillennialism

Remember when prophecy simply meant focusing on Old Testamnet prophetic writings pointing to Jesus’ incarnation and return, and telling our loved ones and strangers about the hope we have in Christ?  As Sarah Leslie reports in her THE RISE OF APOCALYPTIC PAGANISM IN THE CHURCH: BIBLE PROPHECY IN CRISIS article, many prominent evangelical prophecy teachers still profess a basic Premillennial view, BUT there’s been a morphing going on in some circles that mixes New Age and mythology:

“The eschatological teachings of the postmodern evangelical church are in a state of revision and flux. It is no longer possible to categorize endtime teachings according to the old standard recognizable Postmillennialism, Amillennialism and Premillennialism. There are emerging permutations in these teachings, hybrid eschatologies that blend in New Ageevolutionary progression, quantum physics (including quantum spirituality), “incarnating” Christ, “Forerunner Eschatology,”science fictionUFO loresecret codes, and ancient pagan mythologyastrology and apocryphal writings. The result is a prophecy mish-mash. These strange new configurations of eschatology are apocalyptic in nature and go far beyond the descriptions found in Scripture alone. Postmodern endtime prophecy no longer reflects the humble Gospel message of salvation, nor does it find hope in the soon return of Jesus Christ. Source

If you read the above link, you’ll find Leslie points to several teachers doing this, including several members and founders of The Prophecy Watchers.

Hat tip: Laurie Mandeville

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30 Responses to Prophecy watchers morphing into a mixed Apocalyptic bag

  1. Jack Morrow February 29, 2016 at 12:27 pm #

    This is what you get when you “go beyond what is written” (I Corinthians 4:6) and start going to extrabiblical sources to buttress your arguments; eventually you end up way off.

    If I’m not mistaken, Gary Stearman took over the ministry of J.R. Church after Church’s death. J.R. Church wrote “The Hidden Prophecies of the Psalms,” according to which the Lord Jesus Christ should have been ruling on Earth by 1994. And didn’t Tom Horn come from the Vineyard movement?

    Avi Lipkin is also popular with Southwest Radio Ministries, despite his hostility toward Jesus Christ.

    I’m surprised to see Randall Price in there; I’ve always thought of him as pretty solid. Carl Teichrib has written a lot on transhumanism, but I always thought of him as more reasonable than most of the names I recognize here.

    If these people are receiving direct revelation from God, I think I’ll get my Bible from now on in a loose-leaf binder so that I can add these new revelations as they come in. I might need a separate binder for the monthly books coming out from people who claim to have gone to heaven.

    • Amy Spreeman February 29, 2016 at 12:57 pm #

      Excellent comment, Jack.

    • Stephen D March 2, 2016 at 7:44 pm #

      1 John 4:1-6 Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world. Hereby know ye the Spirit of God: Every spirit that confesseth that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is of God: and every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world. Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world. They are of the world: therefore speak they of the world, and the world heareth them. We are of God: he that knoweth God heareth us; he that is not of God heareth not us. Hereby know we the spirit of truth, and the spirit of error.

    • Hannah November 17, 2016 at 5:49 am #

      I’m not trying to ruffle feathers but I don’t see how any of this would not line up with what the Bible says…I’m kinda new to the Christian stuff…but when I asked Jesus in my heart it was my understanding that I am m seated with him at the right hand of the father right now already…so wouldn’t my spirit be there already??? And as Christians don’t we believe our God is bigger than the other gods who I worshiped before I got saved who could do things like through witchcraft and the occult but it was just in an illegal way…I mean the bible does talk about doors and windows in heaven being opened up and being taken up right??? Well that’s what that is…when my old friends who were witches and warlocks practiced spirit travel the would go into the 2nd heaven…well God with a capital G calls us up higher to the 3rd heaven…and I do think he gives us revelation other wise we would never understand that we need him…no offense to any of you but I went and read some of these ppls stuff just to see what y’all were talking about and from what I’ve read of the bible nothing that I saw contradicted what the Bible says….I mean..if you take the Bible literally that is…but I’m very open to anyone explaining more to me bc I am a baby Christian…but I do believe that God is the same today as he was yesterday and therefore he can, will and does work in and through our lives the same…I also believe that the enemy is VERY real bc I used to bat for the other team and I know for a fact that the enemy cannot ‘invent’ things on his own…he just perverts what the lord has for us…so if ‘new age ppl’ or witches’ or whatever you’d like to call them can do it it’s simply bc they have tapped into, and perverted a truth of a Gift of the Lords for us…and that’s just the truth no matter what anyone says…and all this ‘alien’ talk ppl are loosing their stuff about IS in the Bible but they aren’t ppl from other planets…they are talked about in genesis when the devil tried to pollute our blood line…I mean the whole Bible is about Blood and Blood lines.thats why God had his ppl go in and kill everything from men women children down to all the livestock…bc they were the offspring of the fallen angels and human women…they weren’t just not Jews..lol..they were Giants and other bizarre creatures,,,I mean where do we think all these other ‘gods’ came from??? Everyone of these other religions states that these winged beast beings that were givers of knowledge came down from the sky …I don’t understand what the big deal is or why anyone would think it is heresy (sp?)

      • Justina November 17, 2016 at 7:30 am #

        the big problem with these teachings is too much reliance and yet not enough on apocryphal sources. to look for indications in pagan myths, understood as twisted hysterical versions of something several generations before it was written down and maybe you can sort some history out of it is one thing. to assume Osiris or nimrod is going to resurrect from under the great pyramid and be the antichrist is another.

        they rely too much you’ve heard that already. but here’s where they don’t rely enough. All these nephilim nonsense preachers claim that the purpose for the angelic incursion and hybridization was to mess up the human blood line and prevent the Messiah being born because He has to be of pure human blood since He is “kinsman redeemer.” Well, He doesn’t have to be pure human because the atonement/redemption includes all creation, note Rev. 5:13 and something in Romans about the creation awaiting the manifestation of the Son of God (or sons of God, the Second Coming of Jesus with His believers who have died and at that point given resurrection physical bodies with Him). So if animals are included then hybrid humans are also.

        Second, “kinsman redeemer” is an unbiblical exaggeration of a biblical concept which was in civil law that the relative who can afford to do so of someone who for poverty sold himself into slavery had to buy him back out. if it plays any role in typology referred to in the NT it is only once and I therefore missed it, so it isn’t important.

        Thirdly, HERE’S WHERE THEY DON’T FOLLOW THE EXTRABIBLICAL SOURCES ENOUGH. they go beyond them. NOWHERE IN GENESIS OR IN ENOCH OR ANYTHING ELSE IS ANY MOTIVE BUT LUST ASCRIBED. presumably these angels had been telepathically experiencing some of human males’ and maybe females’ sexual feelings and orgasms and decided to try it for real. So they managed a physical manifestation. if you were into the occult that much you know it is possible. Since Jesus crippled the devil and his kingdom it is much more difficult.

        BUT THE ANGELS ARE NONREPRODUCING SPIRIT CREATURES. they got no DNA to provide. being fluid enough to be shape shifters they could make penises for themselves, and some semblance of a nervous system capable of orgasm, but not DNA. no need for it.

        Enoch says they taught the women all kinds of seduction techniques and magick and so forth. I think they would want to increase their position in society and sent the women off to seduce military and political and social leaders find out what they wanted and then offer it to them. Genesis says the earth was full of violence. War has always been the jump starter for technology.

        HERE’S WHERE THEY GO BEYOND GENESIS. It says there were giants in the earth in those days AND AFTER when the sons of God etc. etc. so anomalous giant pure humans existed already. this doesn’t point to a second incursion, but to a prior situation, that continued after perhaps the after influenced by the angels. These giants would be wanted as supersoldiers by everyone. And they would probably have started selective breeding and genetic engineering. And the angels could improve
        the technology.

        DARPA is working along the lines of getting super soldiers that can see in the dark, run faster and jump higher than a normal human and go for 1 to 3 weeks without food (or water?) and be okay for a fight after that. obviously they are going to use non human genes to get some of this. IF they can think of this now, someone could think of it before.

        So the result were not only giants, but GMO or modified humans with reptile, amphibian, bird, non human mammal and insect DNA added. But still human. So far, the weird stuff investigators have got DNA off shows mitochondrial DNA as strictly human, it is the rest of the genome that is squirrely. sasquatch shows human mtDNA and a mix of human and a bit of lemur in the rest of the genome. the platypus has mammal, reptile and bird genes and looks like it. fairly screams genetic engineering. whether any of this was done after the Flood or not is anyone’s guess.

        The giants are nothing like modern alien human hybrids, which are always pathetic and weak in the first generation. that idea they are nephilim of today is laughable.
        there is another game in play involving integration of mostly human “hubrids” into society now, who have telepathic ability to influence people around them.

        The weird looking aliens reported by abductees then are humans descended from the GMO humans who were offworld when the Flood hit. Probably on Mars.

        ANOTHER WAY the nephilim theorists go off track is the notion of pure blood. this is very close to the heretical serpent seedline notion originating among some gnostic heretics that satan had sex with Eve and began Cain. This whole thing of course plays to racist theorizing.

        YET ANOTHER WAY the nephilim theorists go off track is about Noah pure in his generations. Noah was 600 years old when the Flood came, he’d lived through several generations, he was the only righteous one there. purity isn’t just physical (nephilim theorists seem very materialistic) and besides ONLY NOAH WAS PURE and if that means genetics then his wife had nephilim blood whether it showed or not, so did his sons and his sons’ wives so we all do.

        One nephilim theorist has the sense to realize this, so argues we can overcome the influence of such minimal nephilim genetics in us by prayer and focus on Jesus Christ.

        A big issue also is that all evil is ascribed to nephilim blood, and the Fall is ignored. nephilim blood or no nephilim blood we’d be evil inclined and fallen anyway. this kind of nephilim nonsense actually has some people arguing that they can’t be saved if of the wrong race one person was depressed because he figured white was the nephilim lineage and he couldn’t be saved, others figure non whites. whatever.

        as for genetics affecting behavior, well, I hate to think was the reproductive style of the mantis types are, given that most mantis species have the female tearing the male’s head off during sex and eating it, helps the eggs or something like that.

        the “wonderful” seeming kind and anti grey supposedly Nordics from the Pleiades are a pack of liars of course. they have been seen by abductees working with the other aliens types on the same ships, and in one case a Nordic was in charge!

  2. Darrel February 29, 2016 at 1:00 pm #

    Jesus Christ is not enough for these clowns, not in salvation, nor in His dealings with man, nor in His reign over His creation. It does no good to quote Scripture to these self-appointed gurus of the future as they will continue to set dates for the Lord’s return, the revealing of the antichrist, etc. [Tom Horn and Steve Quayle said that the GT began in July 2009 and the antichrist would be revealed on or about 12-25-2012, just in time for Horn’s book “Appolyon Rising” to hit the markets—-what timing!!!] There are some things that we will never know while on this earth, nor are we meant to know, nor are we to inquire of things that are not our business———-specifically the date of the return of the Lord Jesus. All these clowns do is just more proof that they really are false prophets who get their marching orders and all their words straight out of hell.

  3. Robert E. Schoenle February 29, 2016 at 3:27 pm #

    I do not understand why intelligent men and women who profess to be Bible-believing, born-again, Christians insist on giving credence to the dreams and visions they and others have concerning future events. Are they not aware that Bible prophecy is ‘prerecorded’ history authored by God? If so, why not simply believe what the Lord Jesus Christ said?

    1) “ . . . for there is nothing covered that shall not be revealed; and hidden, that shall not be known” (Mt. 10:26).

    2) “For there is nothing hidden, which shall not be manifested; neither was any thing kept secret, but that it should come [to light]” (Mk. 4:22).

    3) “But take heed; behold, I have foretold you all things” (Mk. 13:23).

    4) “For nothing is secret, that shall not be made manifest; neither any thing hidden, that shall not be known and come [to light]” (Lk. 8:17).

    5) “For there is nothing covered, that shall not be revealed; neither hidden, that shall not be known” (Lk. 12:2).

    6) “ . . . I spoke openly to the world; I ever taught in the synagogue, and in the temple, where the Jews always resort; and in secret have I said nothing (Jn. 18:20).

    It seems that most professing Christians are unaware that God has NEVER played ‘gotcha’ with mankind and that the ‘Church’ was NEVER to look forward to the Second Coming [2nd Advent] of the Lord Jesus to planet Earth. The Church was to only anticipate the pre-tribulation return of its Savior, now known as the ‘Rapture’ (Ti. 2:13; 1 Jn. 2:28; 3:2-3; Rev. 22:20).

    Since the Lord Jesus repeatedly said that He has revealed ALL things and that ALL things would be known, why is the teaching that we cannot know the day of the Rapture or of His 2nd Advent so widely accepted? Who am I to believe? The clear teachings of the Lord Jesus or the convoluted teachings of misguided theologians? It is definitely time to reevaluate the accepted teachings that conflict with the clear teachings of the holy Scriptures. Maranatha!

    • Justina November 17, 2016 at 7:37 am #

      “The Church was to only anticipate the pre-tribulation return of its Savior, now known as the ‘Rapture’ ” pre tribbers CONFUSE tribulation with wrath of God. tribulation is
      done by the devil, the wrath of God to which we are not appointed is done by God against the devil the antichrist and their followers because of the great tribulation.

      2 Thessalonians chapter two read all at once, ignoring all you’ve been told, shows pre trib is false. the first few verses address people who think a secret second coming
      to rapture people had happened and they had been left behind. Paul says this hasn’t happened BECAUSE IT CANNOT HAPPEN, EVER, UNTIL THE ANTICHRIST HAS
      APPEARED, AND CHRIST COMES BACK TO DESTROY HIM.

      our blessed hope is not being airlifted out of reach of persecution but the Second Coming of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, and incidentally we will be caught up into the sky to meet Him while He rains wrath on the earth.

  4. Darrel February 29, 2016 at 9:29 pm #

    It must be really hard for you, Robert, to claim to have ears to hear and eyes to see and yet still refuse the Words of the Lord Jesus on this matter:

    “But of that day and hour no one knows, not even the angels of heaven, but My Father only.”*******************Matt. 24:36

    “Therefore you also be ready, for the Son of Man is coming at an hour you do not expect.”***********************Matt.24:44

    “Watch therefore, for you do not know what hour your Lord is coming.”********Matt.24:42

    “Watch therefore and pray always that you may be counted worthy to escape all these things that will come to pass, and to stand before the Son of Man.”******Luke 21:36.

    So tell us Robert is the Rapture still on for Oct. 2, 2016 as you so stated a few days ago on this very blog? What amazing insight you have been given by someone, but certainly NOT the Holy Spirit. The dates that fools set for the Rapture and/or Second Coming will all come and go and the “prophet” will be proven to a false prophet, just like you, Robert, will find out the hard way. Pity those who believe your lies. The above Scriptures cannot be incorporated into your fantasy doctrine of the Rapture because they completely contradict it. No doubt you will try to make it all fit, but you cannot because it does not. Time to repent, Robert, lay this idol aside and your own ego. Every time you speak the hole just gets deeper, your pride more entrenched and you expose yourself as the false prophet that you are.

    • Robert E. Schoenle March 3, 2016 at 4:50 am #

      Guys like you, Darrel, is what is wrong with so many in the ‘Church.’ The reason being that those like you are unable to think and have little discernment. I gave you six statements by the Lord Jesus that clearly state that ALL has been revealed and that ALL would be known. What the heck does the word ALL mean to you? When you read that ‘ALL have sinned, and come short of the glory of God’ (Rom. 3:23) does that mean ALL to you? Or does all only mean a few, or some, or many to you?

      I guess you think that you are being spiritual while you call me names. Your insight is to declare that my insight is NOT of the Holy Spirit. Are you incapable of seeing that your position indicates that the Scriptures are in conflict and have teachings that contradict? Are you going to declare that the Lord Jesus was lying when He said six times that ALL would be revealed and that ALL would be known and that He said noting in secret? I do not believe there is any contradiction in the holy Scriptures. So when the four verses you chose to use to prove me a false prophet are contrary to the six verses I initially used, you need to start thinking and ask yourself why they seem to be at odds? Don’t you get it yet? This is where the thinking part is supposed to kick in for you.

      I have NEVER thought of myself as a prophet. If you had taken the time to read why I have stated what I have, you would know that. But churchgoers, like you, are beyond investigating much of anything. If you had bothered to read my ‘A Biblical View of the Past, Present, & Future!’ you would know that God has ALWAYS told, in advance, WHAT He would do, WHY He would, and WHEN. Thus, beginning with Adam, God has been a date-setter. How about that?

      In a nutshell, the 50 year generation that would see the 2nd Advent began with the ‘War of Yom Kippur’ in October 1973. It only took a 38 year study and search for me to discover that necessary little fact. This made knowing the rest possible. That generation, by the way, began when Egypt and Syria invaded Israel on the ‘Feast of a Day of Atonement.’ Thus, the 2nd Advent will be prophetically fulfilled on the Feast of a Day of Atonement, September 25, 2023. All of the details are given in my previously mentioned treatise. Not that I expect you to do so, but my open invitation to you and others is to read and learn. You now have absolutely zero reasons for not knowing. Maranatha!

      • Darrel March 3, 2016 at 12:03 pm #

        Prophet Bob,

        I will address your statements and will not expect anything from you of a similar nature, rather that you will remain on your pedestal, the all wise “seer” of our day who has had ALL revealed to him and yet refuses to share this “enlightenment” with the underlings of ignorance here.

        So every time the word “all” is used in Scripture you would have us believe that includes everyone, everything, with no exceptions. That’s what Bob says, but what do the Scriptures say? Does “all” always mean “all” without exception?
        1 Cor. 15:22: “For as in Adam ALL die, even so in Christ ALL shall be made alive.”
        To follow your logic & way of thinking that would mean that ALL men everywhere of ALL time will be saved, no matter what. That’s the classic definition of universalism. Are you a universalist, Bob? Don’t forget “all” always means “ALL”.

        Let’s look at Rom. 11:26: “And so ALL Israel will be saved…” Don’t forget now, Bob, all always means all. According to you, every Israelite of all time will be saved—more universalism—but what about Esau? He was hated by God (Mal. 1:3 & 4 and Rom. 9:13. What about Judas? He was a Jew. Is he now in heaven since “ALL Israel will be saved”? Remember now, ALL always means ALL. There are other verses to consider, but think on these two for a while.

        So it’s ok for you to call me THE problem in the church of today, ignorant, unable to “think”, etc., but you can’t handle your title of false prophet? Your own words make you a false prophet. You claim God is a “date setter”, so please show all of us ignorant souls what will happen tomorrow. Who will be the next president of the USA? What is the DATE of the beginning of the “Gog-Magog War? What is the date of the completion of the Third Temple? When will the antichrist show himself to be “god” and assume the throne in the new Temple? You claim that your god is a ‘date-setter’ then tell us Prophet Bob. You deny being a “prophet” so that you won’t have to answer for your own words: ‘rapture will occur on Oct.2, 2016’ and we are now to believe that was not a “prophecy” that will only show the utter falsity of all your words. You expect me to resolve the “discrepancies” (only you find them to be “at odds” with each other) of the Scriptures we both cited, yet you offer no explanation whatsoever. Why? Because you cannot “make it fit” to your fantasy doctrine that we are supposed to know EVERYTHING. Take off your myopic spectacles and read ALL the Word of God. Let’s look at one more verse: “For we know in part and we prophecy in part.” 1 Cor.13:9. So who is lying? Jesus or Paul? Be very careful how you answer, because it was the Holy Spirit Who gave us BOTH of these statements. Are you prepared to be bold enough to call the Holy Spirit a liar? That is precisely what you are doing, whether you realize it or not. No doubt you think yourself quite special in the eyes of your god to have received all these revelations, dates, etc., more special than the common man who is quite satisfied to trust the Lord Jesus with his soul. If only that where enough for you, Bob.

        • Robert E. Schoenle April 8, 2017 at 11:07 pm #

          I don’t wish to offend you, Darrel, by calling you a moron, so I won’t. I may think it so, but I will not say it. I am trying to keep it simple with you because there seems to be little chance of having an intelligent exchange of biblical truths with you. You obviously have a problem in understanding the word ALL when used in the Holy Scriptures. Therefore, I will simply advise you to watch the news like I do with everyone.

          I am convinced the generation that would see the 2nd Advent began with the ‘War of Yom Kippur’ on October 6, 1973. The Rapture will be on the Feast of Trumpets, September 20, 2017, and the Second Coming will take place on September 25, 2023.

          The people at the First Coming ignored something like 300 Old Testament prophesies to not know of it. It is the same in our day. I know this is impossible for you to believe but God EXPECTS us to know in our day just like the generation at the FirstComing should have known.

          I don’t expect you to take the time or to make the effort but I will still invite you to read my ‘A Biblical View of the Past, Present, & Future!’ It is by the Prophecy heading found at http://www.endtimewarnings.net. In it are all the details of what I have said here. In the meantime, maranatha!

      • Justina November 17, 2016 at 7:41 am #

        ” I gave you six statements by the Lord Jesus that clearly state that ALL has been revealed and that ALL would be known.”

        I guess you need to take a remedial reading course. NONE of those statements says all HAS been revealed but that all WILL BE revealed, and when Jesus said He told them all things, clearly He did not tell them when He is coming back because He already said that HE didn’t know this.

        John was told not to write down something he heard in Revelation, so clearly
        there is something that hasn’t been revealed (except to John, which makes it
        revealed I guess) but that wouldn’t count since after Jesus said all that in the Gospels.

        pretrib relies on one key prop, confusing the tribulation with the wrath of God. eliminate this and your whole system falls to pieces. DID NOT JESUS SAY THAT IN THE WORLD YOU WILL HAVE TRIBULATION?

  5. david March 1, 2016 at 12:25 pm #

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AJynlrKfsCE

  6. Stephen D March 2, 2016 at 7:47 pm #

    1 John 4:1-6 Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world. Hereby know ye the Spirit of God: Every spirit that confesseth that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is of God: and every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world. Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world. They are of the world: therefore speak they of the world, and the world heareth them. We are of God: he that knoweth God heareth us; he that is not of God heareth not us. Hereby know we the spirit of truth, and the spirit of error.

  7. Brian May 2, 2016 at 11:21 am #

    The problem is that there is no consensus on what “false teachers” mean in this arena. If we are sticking with Matthew 7:15, then it’s a yes and no when it comes to the mish mash of speakers at this event. But that is only applicable if we are clearly defining the difference between essential and non-essential doctrines such as the doctrines of salvation and everything else. If so, then yes there are false teachers at this event and if I went to this event I wouldn’t give a rip what those guys had to say. I mean, if said speaker doesn’t know the truth of the gospel then what business does he have speaking on eschatological paradigms. Gary and the boys need to drop those dudes if they want any credibility for these events.

  8. Tommy July 19, 2016 at 12:08 am #

    I have followed Prophecy in the News and Prophecy Watchers for quite a few years now. Not once did I hear specific date setting for the Lord’s return. What is wrong with studying extra Biblical material, like the Book of Enoch, if it is made clear it is not spiritually inspired by God? Do you not study history because it is not in the cannon of scripture? Exposing UFO’s and “aliens” for what they are(demonic), is something all churches should be teaching their congregations. Also, uncovering the truth about giants , which were not fully human, gives insight to the truth, and why God destroyed the earth with a flood. So many “Church” people are so bogged down in tradition, they miss out in exploring the entire text of the Bible. I agree to have a non Messianic Jew on the program raises eyebrows, but it also gives a view from the Jewish perspective that helps believers to pray for many lost Jews! And where in the Bible does it say that God no longer uses visions and dreams to communicate with us. Certainly his Word is the authority for all things, but does he stop speaking to us directly thru dreams since Jesus ascended?

    • Justina November 17, 2016 at 7:43 am #

      of course God gives visions and dreams but not all the time and you have to check these against Scripture. the NEw Apostolic Reformation crew are clearly deceived since the office of Apostle is over and done with. the charismatics are mostly deceived since they tend to exalt experience over Scripture.

      • Manny1962 November 17, 2016 at 8:23 am #

        Amen Justina, emotion and experience over scripture. Is it any wonder folks today are looking for and running after miracles? A wicked and adulterous generation seeks a sign………….but none will be given it. Given today’s climate, seeing how eschatology is being fulfilled almost on a daily basis, I would strongly urge my brothers and sisters to hold up any “dreams” or “visions” against what scripture says. As foretold Churchianity is awash with false teachers. Lest we get caught up in their error.

  9. Christine Erikson October 2, 2016 at 3:55 pm #

    Daniel 7 describing the antichrist persecuting the saints until the Second Coming and ALL 2 Thess. chapter two note first few verses RULE OUT ANY PRE TRIB RAPTURE. the harpazo is just being caught up to meet Him in the sky where we stay with Him visible with Him lower atmosphere while He rains wrath on the antichrist and on the antichrist’s followers, then we descend with JEsus to rule with Him on earth.

    imminence of arrival is only possible in the last month of antichrist’s reign. before that we need to act AS IF Jesus is due back immediately even though He clearly isn’t.

    “For there is nothing covered, that shall not be revealed; neither hidden, that shall not be known” (Lk. 12:2). notice FUTURE TENSE and a lot of that when you read more is about the Last Judgement though some comes earlier. clearly the timing of the second coming is in the category of what will be known later.

    Prophet Bob or whatever you consider yourself to be, you may or may not have The Holy Spirit and some help from Him But you are SLOPPY. notice tenses words are used in. THIS IS FUTURE TENSE. this sort of thing is useless for establishing what you are trying to establish.

    as for all made alive doesn’t mean all the other examples are better than this. ALL will be made technically alive, not necessarily spiritually alive in the sense of in relationship to God. ALL without exception will be resurrected into an immortal indestructible physical resurrection body, to be judged at the Last Judgement. Indeed, death will have been abolished. The problem for them is in what conditions they will spend eternity in these immortal indestructible physical resurrection bodies.

    • Robert E. Schoenle October 2, 2016 at 10:37 pm #

      Dear Chris. You should know that I love when ‘religious’ people choose to determine whether I or anyone else has or has not the Holy Spirit. This indicates to me that might be unaware of the ‘seven’ ministries of the Holy Spirit. It also indicates to me that they might not know that EVERY individual who is trusting in the finished work of the Lord Jesus, alone, as being sufficient to pay in full for all of the sins they would ever commit is and will be indwelt by the Holy Spirt throughout eternity. The LORD [self-existant one] made a request to each of us. It was, “Come now, and let us reason together, saith the LORD. . .” (Isa. 1:18a). This means for us to think!

      Through the years I have found far too many professing Christians to be everything but reasonable or logical with their interpretation of the Holy Scriptures. They often will not use Scripture to interpret Scripture or to use the ‘Literal Method of Interpretation’ to understand the truths of the holy Scriptures.

      Since so many are focused on the Second Coming and not on the Rapture that precedes the seven years of tribulation they make silly mistakes and overlook simple truths. For example, we know from the book of Revelation that those seven years consists 2,520 days. All anyone has to do who witnesses the signing of the defense treaty between the leader of the European Union [EU] and the leaders of Israel (Dan. 9:27). is count forward 2,520 days to know when the 2nd Advent to earth by the Lord Jesus will take place. If their day count should be off, then they can reset their counting at the half way point when the Antichrist breaks the treaty. We are clearly told that the Second Coming will be 1,260 days afterward. See how easy all of this is? It is foolish to make all of what God has given us so difficult to understand. Maranatha!

      • Christine Erikson October 2, 2016 at 11:04 pm #

        yes a true believer has The Holy Spirit to some extent. the issue is how active in what way and what gifts IF ANY as distinct from FRUITS you grow under His influence.

        “Through the years I have found far too many professing Christians to be everything but reasonable or logical with their interpretation of the Holy Scriptures. They often will not use Scripture to interpret Scripture or to use the ‘Literal Method of Interpretation’ to understand the truths of the holy Scriptures.”

        exactly. and you aren’t doing this. read the book cover to cover in as short a time as possible, or at least do this with each book at a time. not this pick pick “study.”

        now, seven years of tribulation you mention. and of course pre trib which is A LIE.

        but seven years…..nope. Scripture says time, times and a half and that THREE AND A HALF YEARS. even at a year for a day IF the last seven days are this time THEN it is only at the mid point of that last week 3 1/2 days, that persecution begins.

        Since you got it wrong on the years of tribulation which are THREE AND A HALF not seven, you should ask yourself what else you got wrong, why you got it wrong (listening to the wrong people is a big part but WHY do you listen to them? WHY do you not search the Scriptures not to find if they quoted the verse right but what verses precede and follow, and what else is said on the subject elsewhere in Scripture?) and WHO ARE YOU MISLEADING.

        I repeat. there is no seven year tribulation. that is an absolute howler. 3 1/2 is very clear.

        who started the seven year nonsense anyway?

      • Christine Erikson October 2, 2016 at 11:15 pm #

        I forgot this. your focus on EU and treaty with Israel and blah blah. This is based on assumptions that are groundless.

        a. that there has to be a revived Roman Empire of ten nations. IF SO NOT ONE OF THEM NEED BE IN EUROPE. do you know how extensive the Roman empire was? Europe, all or mostly across north Africa incl. Egypt, the Middle East incl. Turkey and the western part of Persia at one point.

        b. that the statue dream of Nebuchadnezzar is relevant to today. The two legs are obviously the two segments of the Roman Empire, the West we think of and the East, Byzantium, which didn’t fall until AD 1453 (or 14 something I forget the last two numbers maybe). It was whittled away for a few hundred years before.

        the toes and feet mixed with iron and clay that don’t adhere well were done when the LAtin empire in order to maintain itself admitted non Latins to citizenship even to govt. roles, and to be legionnaires and various marriages were done for political reasons and nothing worked, it only slowed the demise.

        the statue dream ends with the Kingdom of Heaven being set up, but not fulfilled. THE FOUR BEASTS SHOWS IT BROUGHT TO FULL POWER AND RULE ON EARTH, ending the antichrist’s reign.

        where does he come from? FROM AN EMPIRE THAT DOES NOT YET EXIST. it doesn’t inherit from the other beasts, they are CONTEMPORANEOUS it crushes and stomps them and Daniel 7:12 shows they are contemporary.

        most likely the winged lion (LXX lioness) is Britain- America and US puppet NATO bear is Russia and four headed leopard could be China or could be a future Kurdistan. more likely China. The fourth empire will arise from something that is either small now or nonexistent.

        the statue is over. forget it.

        the four beasts, or the first three, are NOW. the whole thing could be finished in 20 years or 587 or maybe a thousand.

        And there will be no rapture before a tribulation. 2 Thessalonians chapter 2 makes it clear because it is written to refute worries the second coming had happened and they were left behind, Christ will not come back until the antichrist has arisen, and Christ comes back to do what? airlift us out of his range? no. To destroy the antichrist. We get lifted out of range of the wrath of God which comes because of the tribulation the antichrist has done.

        FORGET ALL YOU THINK YOU KNOW AND START FROM SCRATCH. you will find the Bible teaches core belief points, but is far more complex, in some cases opposite to and other cases nuanced, things you take for granted.

  10. Manny1962 November 17, 2016 at 8:34 am #

    At the end of the day believing in one aspect of the rapture or the other does not save nor condemn, it is not a salvific issue, we know God’s plan as revealed, judgement and restoration. If He in His goodness decides we His bride need not go through the tribulation, He won’t let us, if He does, He is The Almighty, He does what is correct and best for His people. Maybe it’s an issue of trust, if I can trust my God for the small things can I trust Him for the large? I do! So be it as He says! If I must be slaughtered by the beast it will happen, if The Lord says no, it won’t happen! Everyone, stop being afraid, just trust in Him for ALL things! Amen! Maranatha! His will be done!

    • Justina November 17, 2016 at 12:05 pm #

      rapture timing issues is not a salvific relevant doctrine, true, but it involves use or misuse of Scripture in the same way that heretics do it, and sets the believer in pretrib up for two things: potentially dangerous ideas backed by the bible (mishandled the same way pretirbbers do), and not taking appropriate action in a major persecution because they think they will rescued. a lot died because of this in Maoist China.

      • Manny1962 November 17, 2016 at 2:14 pm #

        Yes that is true, but from personal experience I can say For takes care of His own, and in these wicked days prudence does pay off.Maranatha! God bless you!

  11. Manny1962 November 17, 2016 at 2:15 pm #

    *God (pardon typos new Tab)

  12. bobby March 17, 2017 at 1:20 am #

    Well now, I would hate for an unbeliever to stumble onto this page.

    • Amy Spreeman March 17, 2017 at 8:20 am #

      Unbelievers come here all the time.

  13. Forry April 8, 2017 at 8:41 pm #

    It’s all interesting stuff. Lets face it the Christian world view depends on what church and doctrine you are taught. Your eschatalogical view will vary. Your view on the gifts, your view on prophecy will depend on a doctrine or a teaching. You may be a cessaationist , or you may not. One teacher teaches that it’s over, one teaches it’s not..We all fit into different camps.The fundamentals are our foundation.Based on the inerrancy of the word of God. Many christians are only interested in their crusade to be Right, and to tell others that in no uncertain terms they are wrong and God is on my side to prove it.
    My point is scripture does mention, or references, to things that were known in the day by those who grew up in a culture and tradition that we have no idea about. The answer to these are not found in the scriptures but are taken from other sources…eg who were the magicians that Moses was confronted by, 2 Tim:2 .they are named here, but are not found anywhere else in the scriptures.

    My point is that non canonical writings in themselves are not bad and should not be deemed as out of bounds. They can be used to help us gain insights in areas in which we are lacking knowledge in.

    God doesn’t fit in a box. His word leads us to ask questions, to discover who He is and make sense of what His plan is all about. I LIKE listening to Tom and Chuck an LA marzuli. They go deep and make you think about those interesting scriptures that are often glossed over in the Church today. I Don’t have to agree with everything they teach but it’s interesting to me at least any way.

    Keep a soft heart to Jesus, extend His grace in all we do and say.

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